Why Your Hotel’s Brand Promise Breaks At the Front Desk

Glenn: [00:00:01] Hey everybody. Thank you so much for tuning in to No Vacancy Live, the show that has you questioning what happened just before he hit the record button that they’re laughing so much. We got doctor producer Suzanne in the house today. How are you, Suzanne?

Suzanne: [00:00:15] I’m thrilled to be with you for an amazing experience, even though I’m in better weather than you are.

Glenn: [00:00:23] It’s 87 as we’re recording this show today, but while you guys are picturing me outside sunning it up, I also want you to think about how Actabl can help give you the power to profit. Please check out our friends at Actabl. Actabl.com. Got great tools amongst a variety of products. They are going to help you save and I would say the theme of our show today get closer to the the customer. What do you think about that? What do you think?

Speaker 3: [00:00:49] I absolutely love that customer experience. And how do we connect better?

Glenn: [00:00:53] Because quite frankly, Suzanne, this has been coming up more and more in conversation. We have all these great tech tools at our disposal. But there’s this weird disconnect between what seems to be happening in the boardroom versus what’s actually taking place on the show floor. In this case, the hotel, for example. Right. So we’ve got a great brand strategy and consumer experience expert with us today that helps close the gap between that, you know, the brands to help them really enact what they’re trying to do. So let’s bring the stage. Mr. Philipp Mirow.

Glenn: [00:01:29] CEO of Meridian Thinking how are you, sir?

Philipp: [00:01:33] Doing very well here in sunny Florida. I’m sorry to rub that one in.

Glenn: [00:01:37] Don’t be sorry.

Glenn: [00:01:39] It’s like, I don’t know, like you think that there’s this conspiracy against me because literally every guest has to give them a weather, give me a weather report about how they’re in so much better condition than than I am.

Philipp: [00:01:51] I can’t do Fahrenheit, but I can tell you it’s 33 Celsius.

Glenn: [00:01:54] Yeah, that’s sounds hot is what that sounds like. Talk to me. I think that’s in the 70s. Is that right, Suzanne?

Suzanne: [00:02:05] I’m just checking. I honestly, I haven’t checked with the weather was today.

Glenn: [00:02:09] I think you’ve got a double it and add 12 or something.

Suzanne: [00:02:13] Okay, so we’re at a 91 with a feels like 103. So they did get I mean, I feel like at the time of this recording, the United States is going to be impacted by a little bit of a heat wave. And so, but really, I mean, the advantage is we’re out of the water, we’re by the ocean. So as long as you get that beautiful breeze, you don’t feel like you’re suffocating with that heat index. And now have you just have a swimming pool.

Glenn: [00:02:42] I’ll tell you, you’re definitely sounding like a brand strategy expert right now to to change things. Philip. You know, you, you’re, you’re doing this this company, I love that you’ve been out there now for about a year and a half on your own, helping a lot of brands because you, You lived and breathed. You worked in the hotel business. You’ve worked in other areas as well that have helped create this deep understanding of what customers are really looking for right now. So I guess a great way to start is what’s going on? Why do companies have a hard time delivering on the expectations that they think they’re creating and setting the stage for?

Philipp: [00:03:21] You know, it’s a great question. I think there is a real disconnect between brand by PowerPoint and the, the realities of, of everyday guest experiences. Now, of course, the franchise model is part of what makes that particularly complex when you don’t necessarily have control over the operations. But beside that, there is so much that we can do through training, through development to be able to truly deliver on the experiences we promise our guests and our customers. Right? At the end of the day, it’s still the corporation that is putting out the messaging as to what a Hampton delivers on or what a Waldorf Astoria delivers on. Both of those things have. I think as as guests, we have a clear understanding of what those expectations are, right? And unfortunately, the reality is that doesn’t always come to life on property. And that is exactly the gap that I am fascinated with unpacking and understanding to help hotels and the corporations behind them on that journey.

Glenn: [00:04:21] So I would say getting those two sides together can be a complicated task. It seems like something when you just say it, it should be work out. But we all know the reality is that there’s this huge chasm between where do you think that communication most quickly breaks down and the messaging is lost?

Philipp: [00:04:42] You know, I think the messaging is often lost when we have turnover in staffing, which is a frequent challenge that we see at hotels, right? Where our properties are constantly trying to play catch up on, on the right training the right materials even just getting a sense as to what the brand’s identity and voice is. I think you know, and I know this is one of your hot topic favorites is AI can be a big savior, I think in terms of actually helping on the back end of delivering some of those experiences and helping our team members get up to speed faster and smarter to prompt them with the right types of information, the right structure, the right phrasing so that they’re delivering on, you know, the, the quirky tone of voice or the playfulness of a moxie versus the, you know, formality of a Saint Regis, for example.

Glenn: [00:05:40] Right. Yeah. Yeah. Because both the Hampton and the Waldorf can deliver five star service within the context of what that brand is to the consumer, right? Philip.

Speaker 5: [00:05:52] Yes, 100%, 100%.

Philipp: [00:05:54] Right. That five star service or perception thereof is 100% down to the individual to make it happen, right? It. While. While our PowerPoint presentations and our brand pillars and our service standards are intended to be a guide to help people on property deliver us, they’re not always referenced. I can’t always pull up a 500 page document to remind myself of, oh, this is what I’m supposed to do in this situation.

Glenn: [00:06:23] Yeah, that’s so true. What’s really cool now is AI is I wasn’t, I didn’t want to talk about AI right now, but you made a great point. Ai can be used now I’m seeing these products. It was built into one of your former companies, PMS systems, for example, where you could just say, I forgot how to do this, or I need to know how to do this, and it just tells you what to do, or it’ll prompt you to remind you to do a particular service, which is.

Speaker 5: [00:06:48] Which is genius.

Philipp: [00:06:49] And I think I have to commend companies for taking those steps to make life easier for the, the folks on property. But, you know, I think so often even that doesn’t go far enough or we are turning the I, I, I over to our guest to find their own solutions. And actually it should be empowering our, our team members instead because that emotional connection is, is what’s incredibly valuable and what is behind the hospitality that we sell and deliver or supposedly deliver. And so I’d like to see more more brands and businesses take advantage of that.

Glenn: [00:07:28] Yeah. Suzanne.

Speaker 5: [00:07:29] Well, I think that ties.

Suzanne: [00:07:30] To what we heard about a lot happening on the high tech floor and, and the sessions have really, you know, you have this great tool with lots of data potential and speed and efficiency, but really the human that’s delivering the service, we need to stay and remain human centric. And so how can we continue to provide these tools to be enhancements? But in the end, we still have to deliver that service. And really just hearing, I love your mentality of net. We can’t necessarily go to the SOP manual and look up something. It’s that training. But I think that’s another opportunity where some of that disconnect, right comes into play, where you mentioned that turnover. And so that training that needs to constantly be happening. This is one of those gaps where I see in our industry that it’s almost like we train it once and we kind of forget about it and we don’t make that continuous. So how can how can brands and from a corporate philosophy, moving that down to the boots on the ground mentality, like how can we be better at making sure our teams are knowledgeable, comfortable with what they’re doing so that they can deliver this amazing guest service experience?

Philipp: [00:08:48] I think there’s a few things, and I think it’s a great question. I think first and foremost, and this is a word that often gets batted around a lot, which is Empowerment. Too often I think our team members feel like they aren’t empowered to make decisions and do the right thing

Speaker 6: [00:09:06] Even when they’re told they can. Right. Correct. Correct. Yeah.

Philipp: [00:09:10] And, and I think that is, that is a fascinating world as to, you know, how can we, how can we improve that perception that they can do the right thing? Because usually that’s the right answer is doing the right thing. I think the second part is have we overcomplicated the actual training journey to onboard new team members? Are we asking them to remember too many things to know too many things, etc.? Can we simplify knowing that they can pull up anything they need in today’s world at their fingertips? What are the essentials they really need to know?

Speaker 6: [00:09:50] Yeah.

Suzanne: [00:09:51] In that onboarding process, sometimes we have to go back to those basics. So now that you’ve got these tools, how can we realign really and making it out there. That’s great.

Philipp: [00:10:01] Yeah. And you know, one of the, the biggest frustrations I have is I’m sure, given that we all travel a good amount, one of the biggest frustrations is walking into a hotel that you’ve checked in for the 15th time and they go, oh, is this your first time staying with us? Can I give you a quick tour of the amenities? And you think so? I know I may not have checked in with you before, but I promise you, I know my way around this hotel better than you do at this point. Yeah. Why on earth does your system not tell you that? And you know who does a great job of it? Airlines. The amount of times that I’ve had the pass that come up to me and yeah, they’ve got their tablet in their hand or their phone in their hand and that’s okay. But it’s the act of the personal interaction that is meaningful. It’s not the fact that I’m number ten on the list, and it says that they need to go and greet me. It’s the fact that they’re doing it. And I think there’s so much we can learn from other industries that are doing a great job of this. And in theory, as you know, the foundation of hospitality hotels should be working harder at meeting some of those basic needs.

Suzanne: [00:11:11] Listen, I’m going to be really upset that I have to throw my index cards and my folders for all the guests and all the secrets I had to have for those guests to deliver that service and be ready and prepared.

Speaker 6: [00:11:23] So that’s.

Glenn: [00:11:24] Really funny. Now we’ve been talking a lot about the, that disconnect between the executives and the implementation at the property level. But if you don’t really even have a strategy to begin with, all of that stuff is moot. Philip. And that’s this is the kind of stuff I want to talk to you today. How do you think about brand strategy? How do you how are brands thinking their way through what they are, how they connect with customers? And what is it that customers expect from brands? So I want to learn a little bit more from you about that. You, of course, worked with some great brands, like our friends over at Starwood Hotels that has brands such as One Hotels, Treehouse Hotels, baccarat, Heineken. You’ve worked with Moxy Hotels car companies, so you’re doing a lot of this kind of stuff.

Philipp: [00:12:12] I do, and I love it. It’s I love the work that I do in terms of brand strategy. And you’re absolutely right. If you don’t have the strategic foundation, it’s never going to take you anywhere. I think one of the, the biggest takeaways in the last 3 to 4 years is just how quickly brands need to evolve in today’s world, right? When we think back to some of the more legacy brands, like a courtyard or like a Hampton you know, those were brands that were set up with a clear vision and that vision was supposed to stay true for the next 30, 40, 50 years.

Speaker 6: [00:12:48] But it didn’t. It got rid of they got.

Glenn: [00:12:49] Rid of the floral bedspreads and they promised they weren’t going.

Speaker 6: [00:12:52] To.

Suzanne: [00:12:55] Really devastated. Glen. Glenda still can’t get over it.

Philipp: [00:12:59] I mean, look, whatever’s important to you, Glenn, I’m sure is important to other guests out there. Yes. But I think my my cool point of how quickly brands need to evolve in today’s world still, still stands, right? I think today with social media, etc., people get bored and they don’t want the same cookie cutter experience that used to be a guarantee or it used to be a, you know, a sense of security and that sense. I think the industry has evolved to almost that’s become table stakes. And we don’t live in that world anymore where, oh, I don’t know if this is a hotel I can trust for the most part, if it’s part of a larger organization, that expectation is there. And so now we’re sort of moving up Maslow’s hierarchy of needs from, you know, basic security up through to the essentials to, to more experiential opportunities for, for brands to, stand out. And so to come back to your question of, well, how do we go about that? Well, I’ll start with what I think the biggest challenges in, in my world of, of brand strategy is most agencies, when they work with a brand, they come up with really cool, amazing ideas that.

Speaker 6: [00:14:16] It’s more like a.

Glenn: [00:14:16] Campaign that’s more like a tactic than an underlying underpinning strategy to base everything upon.

Philipp: [00:14:24] Right, exactly. Right. Or if it is something more tactical, they’re not thinking through all of the steps it takes to realize and make that idea true, right? They’re not thinking about the operational constraints. They’re not thinking about.

Speaker 6: [00:14:38] They’re not worth.

Philipp: [00:14:38] Consideration.

Speaker 6: [00:14:39] Right? Yeah. Yeah.

Glenn: [00:14:41] It’s funny, Phillip, because I used to do, I did PR for a little bit in my life.

Speaker 6: [00:14:44] Okay. And.

Glenn: [00:14:45] And like say, hey, why don’t we do this? And they’re like, you just, you know, and no smack against PR people. They just didn’t have the understanding. And then the operators would be like, how are we supposed to implement that? How can we make that even happen? So the disconnect happens all the time everywhere.

Philipp: [00:15:01] Exactly right. You know, it could be something as simple as, hey, well, people are asking for breakfast to be open for an hour longer. And can we add a fruit spread in addition to peanut butter? Yeah. Okay. Well, that has a significant operational implication, a commercial implication. And is it really going to move the needle on the guest experience? Maybe not. And so what?

Speaker 6: [00:15:22] Tell that to the.

Glenn: [00:15:23] Fruit spread association account.

Speaker 6: [00:15:25] That you just lost. I’m. I’m sure all your fruit.

Glenn: [00:15:33] I guess you’re switching to jelly. Whatever. Sorry.

Speaker 6: [00:15:37] Go on. Phillip.

Philipp: [00:15:38] No, you’re all good. You’re all good. So I think what I try and do in each of the projects that I get the pleasure of working on is I try to really bring that creative thinking in partnership with the commercial understanding and in partnership with the operational knowledge. Having sat in the brand leader shoes of a of a hotel corporation previously. I know that I need to think about these things from day one and not as an afterthought after the agency has pitched. You know, a uniform partnership with Gucci that will take 18 months for me to negotiate. That’s just not going to happen.

Speaker 6: [00:16:16] But to be.

Glenn: [00:16:16] Fair, that PowerPoint looked really good, Phillip.

Speaker 6: [00:16:19] It did.

Philipp: [00:16:20] And they sold me on it. And then I, you know, you turn around and you go, oh, shit, how do I make this happen now? And the answer is you can’t. And and that’s both disheartening and frustrating for the agency, for the person that commissioned the work for, heck, even down to the property teams who who doesn’t want a Gucci uniform? But you know, that’s where it’s important to think about the full picture in a much more holistic way. And so that’s what I guess our secret sauce is, is being able to, to do that and do it well so that we can actually have an impact on the guests in terms of delivering a great experience on the owner, in terms of ensuring that we’re thinking about the commercial implications and of course, to the brand that we’re growing and building value through through equity that, you know, guests want to buy and want to keep coming back for.

Glenn: [00:17:12] Yeah. Now, I want to go back a little bit to something that you grew up that I think was really, really important to talk about. And this is kind of the area where I think brands are living or dying right now, is that that the change to the modern customer and how to adapt old classic brands, today’s thought without losing the essence of what you are but are still appealing. That’s a pivot that is not working for a lot of older brands that are suffering from irrelevancy. I’m not going to call out any hotel brands, but we all know what some of those are. How are you seeing that nexus of relevancy versus irrelevancy and helping people get over the hump and how to think about that.

Philipp: [00:17:57] I think it’s a great challenge and it’s one that you’re absolutely right. So many legacy or heritage brands that have wonderful equity and have wonderful storytelling and rich history aren’t capitalizing on. Right. I’ll give you the example of Radisson, the, the brand that I used to be the brand leader of Radisson was a brand that frankly didn’t have a lot of love and didn’t have a lot of equity bar history of experience with the guest. But actually, as I started to dig into the brand, what we learned was it was a story of nostalgia. And nostalgia is a wonderful platform for storytelling, for experience creation that we felt was incredibly powerful and meaningful in this era, not just for folks who are wanting to, you know, expect a little bit more safety and security in today’s uncertain world. But we’re actually seeing a huge trend of Gen Z guests who are sort of rediscovering old decades of there’s a bar in New York that I can’t think of the name right now, but it’ll come to me that is a 70s and 80s themed bar. And the, the crowd goes wild over, you know, the rediscovery of the furniture and the design and the drinks and, and all of that.

Glenn: [00:19:25] Yeah, maybe not some of the the meals that we used to have back then.

Speaker 6: [00:19:30] No, we’ll skip those. Yeah. That was I just don’t, I don’t.

Glenn: [00:19:34] Want anything in a, in a jello mold, maybe an.

Speaker 6: [00:19:37] All fruit mold.

Glenn: [00:19:38] Try to make up with the the spreads people, but I don’t know.

Speaker 6: [00:19:43] But yeah, we’re just digging.

Philipp: [00:19:44] That hole now.

Speaker 6: [00:19:46] Phil But Phil like the, the.

Glenn: [00:19:48] The Gen Z people are loving like the the old school pizza Hut with the red roof. I saw a whole thing about that for for example, I love that the the, the Howard Johnson in Anaheim has that 1960s kind of aesthetic to it, you know, and they’re playing.

Philipp: [00:20:06] That’s probably still from the 1960s, though.

Glenn: [00:20:10] Yes, maybe, maybe. But what I, what I will tell you, sometimes it works in your favor. And I got a great video coming up or may have just ran, I don’t know how the order of these things, but I did an interview on on the stage at the Westgate Las Vegas where Elvis used to play when it was back at the, the international and the Hilton. And I got to, I got to see his dressing room. And the dressing room was as it was back then because like the place fell into, nobody cared and nobody changed anything. Nobody did a renovation. And it went on for so long that when the Westgate people came in, they got to step in to go and go, wow, look at the nostalgia, look at the history. And it was like this, a piece of Americana magic that was saved by happenstance. So I just think that little things like that are so cool.

Philipp: [00:20:59] I completely agree, and I think when you can protect something that exists today, you absolutely should. Especially if you can make it relevant again.

Glenn: [00:21:09] So how do you take besides the nostalgia thing, how do you take a brand that meant something to one generation, but make it mean something to a different generation? I had things that I loved and brands I loved growing up as a kid that I had wanted to, or maybe imbue those feelings on my kids, but they just don’t.

Philipp: [00:21:31] It’s a tough one. I think part of it is either translating something the brand is known for today and making it relevant through a fresh angle, a fresh perspective. Let’s take a brand that maybe is known for, for service, right? I think the the definition of service 20, 30 years ago was very different in terms of white tablecloth of, you know, waiters and ties and yeah you know, a sommelier and, and all of those different things that we would probably consider to be a little bit old and stuffy today. That’s right. But that doesn’t mean that service has gone out of fashion. It’s just the way that we deliver on it has gone out of fashion. And so I think there is opportunities for brands like like that to grasp. Well, what does service mean today to guest today? How can we be five stars to come back to your earlier point at that and do it in a way that feels cool and relevant today?

Glenn: [00:22:36] I’ll say one brand that did a really good transition, I don’t know how much you know about it. So I don’t feel like you need to to, to comment on it, but I think Renaissance Hotels did a great job from going from one thing to something that’s more hip and artsy and cultural vibe. So went from not really having a personality to something kind of distinct. So I like those kind of moves as well. And when you see brands like I think Waldorf just plays into what you’re, you’re talking about the service is still there, but it’s more comfortable.

Philipp: [00:23:09] Yes, it’s more contemporary. And I completely agree. Renaissance is a great example of a brand that has made that transition. Well I think what’s super fascinating as well is if we start to, to unpack some of the brands that emerged 20 years ago like a moxie, like an element, right, that are starting to get to that point where they’re feeling a little bit.

Philipp: [00:23:33] What’s, I don’t know if tie is the right word.

Glenn: [00:23:36] They’re feeling like it’s probably time to reevaluate where they are so they can stay with a contemporary audience. That’s how I would say it. If I was still doing PR.

Philipp: [00:23:45] That that is a beautifully expressed way of putting it. I probably would have said some some meaner words. But yeah, you know, when moxie was created, their platform was all around play right with the check in at the bar and the free drink and all of that. But to come back to Gen Z, right? In today’s world, for them, play is much more subtle. It’s not as loud. It’s not as alcohol driven. It’s much more social. And so I think there’s a need to tone that brand down a little bit to make it a little bit more accessible and open versus this kind of party vibe that was relevant and 100% was relevant 20 years ago.

Glenn: [00:24:30] Yeah, it’s, it’s very interesting. It’s amazing how you, in order to be a strong brand that keeps moving forward, you got to pay attention to it all the time. And you can’t just suddenly change it. Like there was this this one Midscale restaurant known in the South that changed its logo and went through that. You know what I’m saying? Yep. Right. And it it like they were trying to chase this modern audience and it was very much against what they were. And there was a real disconnect between what they were, what they said they were, but what they actually were kind of a thing. Right, Philip?

Philipp: [00:25:14] Yeah. I, I feel like they were trying to be something that they, that wasn’t true to their history or their heritage.

Glenn: [00:25:21] Exactly. And that’s why they, that’s why I think they went wrong. And it’s a cautionary tale. Please continue.

Philipp: [00:25:26] Completely agree. Completely agree. Cautionary tale. I think, you know, with these legacy brands, they are fragile. And you have to look after what they are known for. And you’ve got to look after what they stand for. That doesn’t mean you are allowed to stay still, though.

Glenn: [00:25:45] No, no, you can never, ever, ever stay still. You stay still. You’re dead in the water. But I do like, I do like how Barry Sternlicht found a loophole. Right. He created w hotels, was really relevant to his one group of people, then started one hotels and is now relevant to that same group of people. But it’s just totally different vibe now they’re, you know, 25 years older and have different wants and needs. And that’s a brand that really understands what it is fundamentally with a strong point of differentiation. Again, I’m bringing it up because I know you’ve had some inner interactions with them, and I think they might be fun to talk about for a second or two with.

Philipp: [00:26:24] Yeah, I mean, one hotel is, is this massive phenomenon of a brand that I think has has grasped that particular older millennial luxury audience in such an amazing way. I think not all of their moves have been have landed as well as they could have done. You know, the, the launch of their loyalty program, I think is one area where you think, oh, I don’t know if they got that right, but I think what they have gotten right every time. Is the feeling you walk into a one hotel and it just instantly feels like I can relax. I can let go. I’m not on show. Everything is beautiful and I’m beautiful in it. You know, that’s kind of the vibe that you get and you can kind of tone it up or down, depending on the different FNB venues and the different locations in the property. And that I think is a wonderful creation that he’s, he’s in Miami.

Suzanne: [00:27:18] I think you add all the value in what you just said to toning it up, toning it down. When you sit in that lobby

Speaker 7: [00:27:27] And my, and I’ll, and I’ll throw in.

Glenn: [00:27:30] Plus it’s you know, plus it’s a conversion property. And they did an amazing job completely reinventing that. I was also I had the opportunity to host their conference back in April and it was in West Hollywood. And that’s another great, like, reused type of structure. I absolutely love that they’re able to create something so awesome and bring new life to to a branded property that couldn’t meet up with the, the modern expectations of the audience, even if their buildings have a little of that old school infrastructure. It’s still, it’s still amazing.

Philipp: [00:28:07] Yeah. No, I mean, they, they do a fantastic job of, of telling that story and really preaching to the, the, the choir and, and, and telling their sustainability narrative in a compelling way. The work I got to do with them, which was so fascinating, was to actually turn the cards and not focus on the guest for once, but to focus on team members. And that was so incredible to get to not only spend time with with team members back of.

Glenn: [00:28:38] Leo, I guess.

Philipp: [00:28:40] Correct. Yeah. And so being able to, to help translate how you bring the brand strategy that is, you know, guest facing to the back of house. You know, we talked about things like being able to bring nature sounds into those packed corridors that, you know, are stacked with housekeeping carts. How do we bring a little bit of that energy of calm, of serenity into the back of house? How do we tell our story? How do we empower our team members to do good for the planet and those kinds of initiatives? So really lovely to see that it isn’t just a guest facing narrative, but something they live and breathe every day. And to be able to be part of shaping that was super meaningful.

Glenn: [00:29:27] That’s awesome. All right. So you work with Bristol Airport.

Philipp: [00:29:31] Yeah.

Speaker 7: [00:29:32] All right.

Glenn: [00:29:32] So how does an airport think about strategy and stuff like that? Because I think they could just be lazy and be like, people got to fly. So what do we have?

Speaker 7: [00:29:40] You know, so.

Philipp: [00:29:41] That was, it’s, we’re going back a few years now. That was an operational role that I did. So part of part of my work was I was actually the duty manager for security at Bristol Airport. Which you know, not many people think about, but I wanted to make sure that as I, I talk about Meridian thinking and, you know, this perspective of creative thinking operations and commerciality is that, hey, I’ve, I’ve worked boots on the ground in an operational role in various different settings. And the lessons you learn from that are incredibly valuable in shaping brand strategy and experiences.

Glenn: [00:30:24] And with so many hotel operators coming out of that real estate investment side, rather than the operational side, it’s more critical than ever to work with somebody like Philip, for example, that could really help connect those dots. Suzanne, you got any more questions for our, our our guy over here?

Suzanne: [00:30:45] I am just thrilled to know that I have another Miami individual that has a great philosophy and putting brands in operations and making it all work in terms of strategy. So it’s a pleasure to have gotten to meet you, Philip.

Philipp: [00:31:00] Likewise. And I can’t wait to have drinks together at the one.

Speaker 7: [00:31:05] Yeah. That’s a really, it sounds like.

Glenn: [00:31:07] A really great idea. I’m actually going to be down there in November for a conference. So we should all, we should all get together. Then.

Speaker 7: [00:31:13] But.

Glenn: [00:31:14] Long before that you’ve gotta, you’ve got some, some work to do. And hopefully with some people that have been watching the show, how can we learn about you? How can we find you?

Philipp: [00:31:23] You can find me on Meridian thinking.com. Look me up on LinkedIn and always happy to take a call, grab a coffee or chat about brands and their experiences.

Speaker 7: [00:31:34] Yeah.

Glenn: [00:31:34] And also, Phil, Philip reached out to me to just to say, hey, would you be interested in this? And I was excited because I just wanted to totally geek out. So thanks for, for coming today. It was a lot of fun. And I appreciate you putting up with my very bad jokes today.

Speaker 7: [00:31:46] So I.

Philipp: [00:31:47] Appreciate you. Thanks for having me on. I’m off to go and put the jam business back into my good my good books.

Speaker 7: [00:31:59] That’s good. I’m so glad.

Glenn: [00:32:01] We’re finally tackling the tackling the important issues here on No Vacancy. And that’s why you tune in. Thanks, Phillip. We will see you next time after this one. I’m not sure there will be a next time. I don’t know if you could cancel an internet show, but

Suzanne: [00:32:16] There will be a next time. It’s just a matter of when. You and I will have our next time together.

Speaker 7: [00:32:21] That is true. And if you’re.

Glenn: [00:32:22] Waiting for our next time together and can’t wait, well, just watch, listen, follow, subscribe to any of our shows, get our back catalog. We’ve got, I don’t know, 2000 shows or something like that back there. So plenty to occupy you too. Hey, binge until next year would be, I guess. Anyway, thanks so much for watching everybody. Remember, you’ve got one life, so blaze on and.

Suzanne: [00:32:45] Follow your passion.

Glenn: [00:32:47] Yeah, baby. See you all later. Bye.