00:00.956 –> 00:02.437
Anthony, so good to see you today.

00:02.457 –> 00:08.643
But I have some devastating gum-related news that I’m going to have to share with you today.

00:09.423 –> 00:10.444
I can’t wait to chew on it.

00:11.325 –> 00:11.845
I’m Anthony.

00:12.026 –> 00:13.347
Welcome to No Vacancy Live.

00:13.667 –> 00:14.528
That’s my friend Glenn.

00:14.708 –> 00:16.870
You’re watching the number one show in hospitality.

00:30.458 –> 00:33.420
Everybody, thanks for watching the one and only No Vacancy Live.

00:33.461 –> 00:34.942
Of course, I’m Glenn Hausman.

00:35.042 –> 00:36.183
That’s Anthony Melchiorri.

00:36.203 –> 00:38.104
Thanks so much for joining us today.

00:38.124 –> 00:40.126
We’re going to have a great show today, Anthony.

00:40.566 –> 00:48.133
We’ve got Jan Freitag on from CoStar STR, giving us all that we need to know to inform us on industry statistics today.

00:48.153 –> 00:48.933
What do you think about that?

00:50.094 –> 00:51.195
Give me the gummy news.

00:51.636 –> 00:51.956
All right.

00:53.285 –> 01:01.029
It pains me, but the world’s worst gum and my childhood favorite, Fruit Strike gum is going away forever.

01:01.390 –> 01:02.831
And I don’t know how to process this.

01:02.911 –> 01:05.532
It had all this amazing flavor for about a half a second.

01:05.912 –> 01:08.374
And then it was like cardboard after that, but I loved it.

01:09.014 –> 01:16.762
I want to tell you how impressed I am that after that devastating news, you still made it time for us today.

01:18.304 –> 01:20.126
Listen, there are people that go to war.

01:20.626 –> 01:21.707
There are Green Berets.

01:21.968 –> 01:23.189
There are Navy SEALs.

01:23.749 –> 01:26.973
But they got nothing on you after you heard those devastating news.

01:27.013 –> 01:27.073
Hey,

01:27.293 –> 01:44.527
listen nothing against them but i’ve earned my fruit stripes that’s for sure let’s see let’s see if uh yad is able to continue with the show yeah fry tag special director show star how are you would you like that as a kid do you have any uh experience with fruit stripe gum

01:44.887 –> 01:46.228
How do I jump into that?

01:46.288 –> 01:47.470
Dude, I grew up in Germany.

01:47.570 –> 01:49.131
I don’t even know what you’re talking about.

01:49.171 –> 01:49.752
I didn’t think so.

01:49.772 –> 01:50.112
Yeah, yeah.

01:50.132 –> 01:50.512
All right.

01:50.612 –> 01:51.213
I had a feeling.

01:51.293 –> 01:52.514
It was a terrible gum.

01:52.815 –> 01:59.601
It was like a gum for kids that had a tiger on it, and it was really exciting.

01:59.621 –> 02:05.727
They’re all different flavors, but it burst in flavor literally for two seconds and then went away.

02:05.787 –> 02:06.327
Hopefully…

02:07.208 –> 02:11.233
That won’t be what’s going on in the hospitality industry this year going forward.

02:11.253 –> 02:17.459
That’s why we kind of have you on today, Jan, to take us through how you’re seeing it based on all of your research.

02:17.479 –> 02:19.261
We’ve got a lot of stuff going today.

02:20.042 –> 02:20.963
Where do you want to start, sir?

02:21.960 –> 02:26.743
Wow, you took a sharp left turn there from— Hey, listen.

02:26.803 –> 02:29.165
There’s a reason why people call me the Segway King.

02:29.185 –> 02:30.465
All right, nobody calls me that.

02:30.625 –> 02:33.067
I’m just hoping that if I say it enough, it’ll work.

02:33.087 –> 02:35.789
I’m hoping that he stopped chewing on that and moved forward.

02:36.849 –> 02:37.650
It was getting painful.

02:39.657 –> 02:40.077
Exactly.

02:40.557 –> 02:40.797
All right.

02:40.837 –> 02:49.044
So I got you just wrote an article the other day, you know, two days ago as we’re broadcasting this on questions for the U.S.

02:49.064 –> 02:51.746
hotel industry in twenty twenty four.

02:51.886 –> 02:55.068
But you also provided to me a lot of great slides.

02:56.169 –> 02:58.491
So we got this going on that we’re going to follow with today.

02:58.911 –> 03:00.572
Jan, where would you like to begin?

03:00.592 –> 03:03.314
Should we start with the questions and then go to the slides to relate to them?

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Does that make sense?

03:04.215 –> 03:06.757
I mean, it all sort of builds together.

03:07.317 –> 03:10.860
If you go maybe to the first slide, I think that’s the forecast slide.

03:10.880 –> 03:12.081
Yeah, so let’s just go with that.

03:12.101 –> 03:14.142
You probably want to know what are we thinking.

03:14.243 –> 03:15.263
You have your perspective.

03:15.283 –> 03:16.484
Right, we sure do.

03:16.704 –> 03:21.928
And before we get into it, let me just tell the listening audience, if you’re listening to our audio feed, check the show notes.

03:22.108 –> 03:26.091
I will have this presentation available for you to watch along with us.

03:26.151 –> 03:30.755
But Jan, try to throw out as many numbers as you can to create an audio picture for people as well.

03:32.057 –> 03:32.778
what I love doing.

03:33.278 –> 03:40.584
So what we’re proposing for 2024 is continued growth in REVPAR, which is good.

03:41.544 –> 03:45.747
We suggest that the American economy is going to continue to expand.

03:45.767 –> 03:47.409
GDP growth is going to be positive.

03:47.629 –> 03:49.530
Our friends from Oxford Economics tell us that.

03:50.011 –> 03:52.893
And with macroeconomic growth comes demand growth.

03:53.213 –> 03:56.035
So we’re saying demand is going to grow by just under 2% or so.

03:57.797 –> 03:59.498
And supply is not a headwind.

03:59.698 –> 04:05.201
You’ve had a lot of developers and owners on and everybody’s saying, ah, we can’t just pull the trigger.

04:05.702 –> 04:12.886
So supply growth is 0.8% projected for this year, which is really well below the long run average of 2% or 2.1%.

04:14.167 –> 04:18.329
So really limited headwind.

04:18.469 –> 04:19.590
So really more of a tailwind.

04:20.370 –> 04:24.014
of supply demand growth because the American economy is growing.

04:24.434 –> 04:26.757
And then the question is, how much are room rates growing?

04:27.517 –> 04:34.805
And there’s clearly a relationship between consumer price index, CPI, inflation, and how much we’re growing our top line.

04:35.225 –> 04:38.308
And so we’re saying that room rates are going to grow by, call that 3% or so.

04:40.330 –> 04:49.352
And so you have occupancy growth of a point, an ADR growth of three, and that gets you to sort of 4% RAFPA growth for the year.

04:49.372 –> 04:58.675
Amanda Haidt from STR will be on the stage of the ALICE conference and give you the latest forecast, but it’s not going to change drastically from what we are saying.

04:58.695 –> 05:00.295
Does that sort of jive with what you’re hearing?

05:00.635 –> 05:02.836
Yeah, and it sounds exactly like what we’re hearing.

05:02.856 –> 05:11.700
Of course, the Atlas Conference is coming up on Monday, the 22nd and 23rd at the LA Live Center in downtown LA.

05:11.800 –> 05:14.581
I’ll be there, and I know a lot of you will be too.

05:14.641 –> 05:18.443
So yeah, Anthony, how are you seeing this based on the conversations we’ve been having?

05:19.063 –> 05:22.684
I mean, they’re the best in the business, so I’m taking it as the scripture.

05:23.625 –> 05:27.866
With that said, this is, with all that…

05:29.247 –> 05:32.149
wins in our face with everything that’s going on.

05:32.209 –> 05:37.673
And I don’t have to list all the things that are going on in our economy and in our world.

05:38.734 –> 05:40.956
This seems to be optimistic.

05:42.557 –> 05:46.560
And I was a little surprised by 4% growth.

05:47.721 –> 05:51.203
But again, I’m sure that’s, you know, it’s going to happen.

05:53.388 –> 06:15.488
how the challenges in our world how can we still have that four percent meaning um where are we with inflation where are the interest rates where are people tired of um you know are we over that surge travel where we’re just fed up and we want to leave our house um so what went into these numbers

06:16.863 –> 06:23.707
Anthony, you put your finger exactly on this question that I have and that a lot of macroeconomists have.

06:23.987 –> 06:25.848
There is a lot of good data.

06:26.228 –> 06:27.949
Unemployment rate is really low.

06:28.269 –> 06:30.250
The inflation rate is coming down.

06:30.710 –> 06:37.534
The American economy did not go into recession last year, is likely not going to go into recession this year, and is growing.

06:37.834 –> 06:43.137
And at the same time, there’s one data point that is counter to everything, which is consumer sentiment.

06:43.817 –> 06:46.199
The consumer sentiment is way down.

06:46.239 –> 06:52.946
The Michigan survey says Americans are feeling not really good about themselves and about the state of the union.

06:53.506 –> 06:59.232
But all the macroeconomic indicators and our ADR and REFPA forecast are quite positive.

06:59.612 –> 07:02.475
And how do you match those two together?

07:02.515 –> 07:02.675
Right.

07:02.735 –> 07:08.080
You’re putting your finger exactly on the question that I get a lot that a lot of people have.

07:09.011 –> 07:12.052
So I think there are a couple of things to think about.

07:12.292 –> 07:18.814
One is we still have continued growth in corporate transient demand, right?

07:18.914 –> 07:21.454
We’re not all back on the road yet.

07:22.795 –> 07:26.456
Number two, group travel is back and back roaring.

07:26.676 –> 07:31.377
In October, we hit the total group demand that we hit in 2019 October.

07:32.157 –> 07:33.658
So we’re back on group.

07:33.698 –> 07:34.398
That’s unbelievable.

07:36.032 –> 07:38.813
Corporate transit, we’re not quite back, but there’s more room to grow.

07:39.114 –> 07:41.495
And on the leisure side, you make an interesting point.

07:42.015 –> 07:47.018
Was 2023 the year of the great international outbound, right?

07:47.138 –> 07:52.161
We’re all on Instagram and all your friends were in Greece and in Venice and Berlin.

07:53.141 –> 07:57.244
Will they in 2024 now say, look, I was in Venice.

07:57.304 –> 07:57.644
I’m good.

07:57.884 –> 07:59.406
I’m going to go back to Colorado, whatever.

07:59.886 –> 08:02.528
Will we see the pendulum swing back a little bit?

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And will we have some international inbound?

08:04.889 –> 08:09.192
So we think there’s still some room on the demand side to grow.

08:09.813 –> 08:12.855
And then I think on the ADR side, it’s just inflation.

08:13.175 –> 08:14.296
Everything gets more expensive.

08:14.336 –> 08:15.497
Hotels get more expensive.

08:16.037 –> 08:16.217
All right.

08:16.237 –> 08:18.619
Let me throw this out and see if you guys agree with this.

08:18.639 –> 08:19.460
Yeah, Anthony, go ahead.

08:19.480 –> 08:21.641
Let me just make that note because I meant to say that.

08:21.681 –> 08:22.682
And I think that’s a really good point.

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There are many years where we’re really, really sensitive to rate.

08:27.598 –> 08:32.101
And the guest says, we don’t want to pay that rate and we lower our rates and we have no choice.

08:32.221 –> 08:33.742
And obviously that’s going to continue.

08:34.082 –> 08:43.548
However, I will say we are going to be more stringent and more, we’re not going to move rates easily.

08:44.068 –> 08:53.090
We’re going to have to have a lot of data and we’re going to have to have a lot of information and a lot of concern before we start just adjusting rates so we don’t meet our budget.

08:53.110 –> 08:56.351
Because years past, that can flow.

08:56.511 –> 08:58.311
You can find expense savings.

08:58.731 –> 09:01.752
You can find, you know, let’s hold off on this.

09:02.312 –> 09:03.713
You can find labor savings.

09:03.733 –> 09:04.833
You can’t find it anymore.

09:06.033 –> 09:07.314
The labor we have, we need.

09:07.674 –> 09:11.475
Their payroll is up 30%, 40%, depending on what market.

09:12.235 –> 09:13.216
Taxes are up.

09:13.596 –> 09:19.818
So that ADR, I believe the ADR simply because revenue management is so sophisticated today.

09:20.518 –> 09:23.059
And that vice president of revenue management,

09:23.479 –> 09:35.489
who’s going to have to really consider maybe changing rates because they don’t see the demand there, they’re going to come up with some creative ways to ensure that they meet that budget they put on the books.

09:35.529 –> 09:40.974
Because this year, more than I’ve seen since 2008, this is a critical year for the bottom line.

09:41.795 –> 09:47.800
The bottom, bottom line, not the gross operating expense, but the bottom, bottom line.

09:49.193 –> 09:49.593
Absolutely.

09:49.633 –> 09:50.694
We talk about this.

09:51.114 –> 09:54.775
I’m sorry, this gets a little wonky, but this idea of nominal versus real.

09:54.835 –> 09:59.957
So in economy, we talk about the nominal rate growth and the real rate growth, the inflation adjusted rate growth.

10:00.237 –> 10:00.397
Right.

10:00.637 –> 10:10.440
And if inflation is, I don’t know, 3% and your room rate is, I don’t know, growth is, I don’t know, 3%, you know, that leaves you nothing like 0% in real change.

10:10.940 –> 10:22.972
So you’re putting your finger right on the topic of conversation that a lot of GMs have with their owners and owners have with their management team to say, look, guys, this is all about driving GOP.

10:23.312 –> 10:26.015
Top line will grow, yes, but how much of that is falling through?

10:26.555 –> 10:32.882
Yeah, they have no choice to make the budgets they put on paper this year because the expenses are extraordinary.

10:33.942 –> 10:34.122
Right.

10:34.442 –> 10:39.486
And I would say, fortunately, and this is my opinion here, I’m curious as to what you gentlemen think about this.

10:39.786 –> 10:45.510
I think that part of the reason why we’re going to see rev par growth is people will be cutting back certain things in their life.

10:45.550 –> 10:47.911
But I don’t think that has to do with travel.

10:48.412 –> 10:50.713
They may go out to dinner a few less times at home.

10:51.053 –> 10:53.335
I think they may not go to the movies as much.

10:53.415 –> 10:56.817
They may cut back on buying certain goods online.

10:56.897 –> 11:01.782
But I think it’s been well established over the last 15, 20 years that people feel that they need to travel.

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They need to get out there.

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They need to do that more.

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And that’s more fulfilling in people’s lives.

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And I think for the first time, we’re starting to see Gen Z people who live that ethos more entering the entering the mainstream.

11:13.032 –> 11:16.555
They’re starting to get jobs and they’re doing all of that travel as well.

11:17.236 –> 11:21.178
Then everybody’s grandparents, baby boomers are doing that as well.

11:21.318 –> 11:28.481
So I think that there’s anecdotally, there’s a lot of evidence that people will choose travel over other parts of the economy.

11:28.901 –> 11:33.603
Not only that, but for all disillusion with politics and stuff, we’re just like, ah, forget about it.

11:33.623 –> 11:35.744
I’m going to get out of here and go away for the weekend, you know?

11:37.423 –> 12:01.082
the i think what we learned if we run anything in 2020 it’s never been against the american leisure consumer right right like they are ready to go and ready to spend but i think glenn your argument about trading down on like not going to the movies all the time getting netflix or not going to the nice restaurant going to a quick service restaurant right that also translates to the hotel space

12:01.762 –> 12:01.962
Right.

12:02.242 –> 12:06.023
Like you may have you may used to go to a full service hotel on the beach.

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And now you’re like, well, let’s just walk two blocks and stay in a limited service.

12:10.024 –> 12:10.985
Yeah, totally.

12:11.165 –> 12:12.245
And I agree with that.

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But then you get into that problem.

12:14.106 –> 12:15.326
And I’m curious to how you have to think.

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And now we’re just totally deviating off the plan for today.

12:18.547 –> 12:19.827
That mushy middle.

12:19.927 –> 12:20.227
Right.

12:20.327 –> 12:23.548
It’s like people go down or they go up with the hotels.

12:23.568 –> 12:27.009
But the ones in the middle, I think, are usually left holding the bag.

12:27.029 –> 12:27.930
And again, anecdotally.

12:27.990 –> 12:29.350
But do you see numbers to support that?

12:31.539 –> 12:33.411
We don’t call it mushy middle for one.

12:33.471 –> 12:34.477
We call them, you know,

12:39.837 –> 12:44.060
So those types of properties have done really, really well.

12:44.100 –> 12:48.744
But I think part of it is driven by the return of the corporate transient traveler.

12:48.964 –> 12:56.911
You know, we had the CHIPS Act where the American infrastructure bills, you know, we’re having a lot more people on the road building things.

12:57.252 –> 13:02.756
And those are traditionally staying in those roadside, you know, hotels, motels, you know, branded often.

13:03.257 –> 13:05.559
And those types of properties have done quite well.

13:06.223 –> 13:09.765
Yeah, which is why we’re seeing even more extended stay hotels.

13:09.785 –> 13:12.327
And congratulations to Hilton for naming H3.

13:13.527 –> 13:15.168
LiveSmart, which I think is pretty cool.

13:15.188 –> 13:16.469
All right, back to the slides.

13:16.809 –> 13:17.870
What’s your name?

13:17.930 –> 13:18.550
I didn’t get the name.

13:19.731 –> 13:21.212
LiveSmart Studios.

13:22.174 –> 13:23.855
L-I-V, live smart.

13:24.396 –> 13:25.557
I like that.

13:25.877 –> 13:26.297
It’s great.

13:26.317 –> 13:27.118
The logo’s great.

13:27.898 –> 13:29.039
It’s pretty poppy.

13:29.079 –> 13:36.424
I’ve seen some names for new brands come that are pretty whatever, but I think this one really connects with me.

13:36.444 –> 13:36.664
All right.

13:36.984 –> 13:41.708
So business-focused hotels seem to be doing really well, except for economy.

13:42.288 –> 13:44.889
But I guess that makes sense if it’s business, right?

13:44.929 –> 13:52.952
So you’re looking here, upper upscale hotels, big super tanker, large meeting rooms have done really well in 23.

13:53.452 –> 13:55.193
Because of the good business?

13:56.033 –> 13:56.713
Absolutely. 100%.

13:58.314 –> 14:01.356
Group is back to 19 levels in certain months.

14:01.856 –> 14:03.377
Of course, corporate trans is back.

14:03.417 –> 14:05.799
People are back in the office.

14:05.819 –> 14:08.080
3-2, 2-3 hybrid, whatever.

14:08.420 –> 14:14.244
When I joke with my friends at Blackstone or JP Morgan, they’re like, yeah, we’re either five days in the office or seven days in the office.

14:14.304 –> 14:15.164
We don’t do this like 2-3.

14:16.485 –> 14:17.006
Three, two.

14:17.326 –> 14:26.774
But for a majority of people who are back downtown in the office, that means that business travelers can come back to the downtown hotels to meet with people in the office.

14:27.295 –> 14:27.455
Right.

14:27.575 –> 14:31.058
What’s interesting, you see on the luxury side here, room rates are down.

14:31.298 –> 14:32.700
And you’re like, wait, how does that work?

14:32.780 –> 14:33.781
Everything is more expensive.

14:34.261 –> 14:36.622
This is purely the mixed shift we talked about.

14:36.902 –> 14:42.544
So in 2022, the room rates we sold on the luxury side were mostly leisure.

14:42.804 –> 14:44.424
And they paid bar, right?

14:44.624 –> 14:46.345
Rest available, top end.

14:46.405 –> 14:48.786
And a lot of them wanted to, but suites and villas and whatever.

14:49.426 –> 14:56.513
But now we’re layering in incentive groups and corporate negotiated rates and all of this taking the average down.

14:56.593 –> 14:58.775
So, Anthony, back to an earlier point from you.

14:58.815 –> 15:05.101
We are in this interesting environment where the American leisure consumer is going to continue to see their rates going up.

15:05.501 –> 15:13.129
But the STR CoStar data is going to show a slowing in rate growth because we’re layering those low rated data.

15:13.689 –> 15:15.452
groups and corporate transient in.

15:15.632 –> 15:17.775
That’s why ADRs on the luxury side are down.

15:17.815 –> 15:19.418
It’s a mixed shift, not discounting.

15:19.458 –> 15:20.079
It’s a mixed shift.

15:20.460 –> 15:21.922
So you don’t like your job, do you?

15:24.158 –> 15:24.798
What can I say?

15:24.839 –> 15:25.179
It’s data.

15:25.279 –> 15:25.959
It’s beautiful.

15:27.400 –> 15:28.701
You look like a kid going to a candy store.

15:29.122 –> 15:30.122
Yeah, I love this.

15:30.242 –> 15:30.563
I love it.

15:31.483 –> 15:35.526
And you’re a perfect match for us because we love walking out on this type of information too.

15:35.866 –> 15:39.369
So I think what you’re really saying, for example, if you’re looking at this luxury thing, right?

15:39.689 –> 15:41.170
So occupancy is up.

15:41.470 –> 15:43.712
So they’re selling more rooms now.

15:44.052 –> 15:55.541
for groups, but instead of me as a leisure customer where I may have been paying 500, there’ll be more occupancy, but maybe I negotiated a grade of 279 for my group or something like that, right?

15:55.561 –> 15:56.282
That’s exactly right.

15:56.582 –> 16:02.827
Or we had a lot of resorts, you know, luxury resorts with like thousand dollar rates.

16:02.887 –> 16:12.735
I mean, you read those reports, you see that, you know, but now suddenly people are coming downtown, the luxury rates there are maybe 800, you know, and that obviously that’s less, it’s still a lot, but it’s less.

16:13.376 –> 16:14.437
Yeah, absolutely.

16:14.457 –> 16:15.717
All right, next slide.

16:15.957 –> 16:18.658
Group demand, as you were saying, crushing.

16:18.678 –> 16:22.300
That is just to show, yeah, we’re back.

16:22.440 –> 16:28.623
And this goes back maybe a little bit, and I think we’ve talked about this before, because we’re not in the office anymore.

16:29.011 –> 16:32.333
But ahead of HR, our CEOs still have to build culture.

16:32.453 –> 16:33.354
How do you build culture?

16:33.394 –> 16:35.816
Well, you’ve got people together in the office together.

16:36.096 –> 16:39.218
Let’s just have a quick meeting in, I don’t know, Nashville.

16:39.538 –> 16:41.540
Wednesday night, everybody comes in, nice dinner.

16:41.880 –> 16:44.061
Thursday morning, team building and training.

16:44.301 –> 16:48.284
Thursday afternoon, some other activity, and then everybody leaves.

16:48.304 –> 16:52.247
And those are group rooms that didn’t exist, arguably, in 2018 and 2019.

16:54.568 –> 16:59.573
Yeah, and this is exactly what we’ve been talking about as a trend here on No Vacancy.

16:59.613 –> 17:04.517
All right, so international outbound still strong, which has been hurting domestic demand.

17:04.557 –> 17:07.780
But Jan, I’m getting the feel that you’re right.

17:07.900 –> 17:10.242
I think everybody did 21.

17:10.903 –> 17:12.744
I mean, 22, we’re going to party here.

17:12.764 –> 17:14.766
23, we’re going to party overseas.

17:14.886 –> 17:16.488
And 24, I think we’re going to come back.

17:16.548 –> 17:19.851
But how are you seeing this reflected in last year and going forward?

17:20.472 –> 17:25.355
Yeah, so I think the yellow dots show comparisons, same month, 2019.

17:25.635 –> 17:31.599
And you see on the left-hand side, the international inbound is down, what is it, minus 20, minus 15, minus 10.

17:32.740 –> 17:35.201
But I think it’s getting better, right?

17:35.261 –> 17:37.163
It’s not as bad as it was.

17:37.183 –> 17:40.204
And I think we’re going to see some China inbound.

17:40.264 –> 17:42.386
We’re going to see some Japan inbound.

17:42.646 –> 17:45.408
Depending on how the dollar is, we’re going to see some European inbound.

17:45.908 –> 17:49.210
And I think on the right-hand side, you see Americans leaving the U.S.

17:49.370 –> 17:52.012
to the tune of up 10%, 20% compared to 19%.

17:52.732 –> 17:54.754
And I think that’s going to slow.

17:54.854 –> 17:56.435
We’re in an election year.

17:56.475 –> 17:57.716
There are two wars going on.

17:57.776 –> 18:02.198
Everything that Anthony didn’t want to mention sort of weighs on people’s minds.

18:02.278 –> 18:06.041
And maybe they’re going to say, look, let’s just stick closer to home.

18:06.581 –> 18:06.821
Right.

18:07.001 –> 18:07.262
Yeah.

18:07.662 –> 18:09.343
Anthony, do you think that makes sense?

18:09.383 –> 18:11.164
It makes perfect sense.

18:11.284 –> 18:13.225
I’m gigging out on the –

18:16.204 –> 18:21.549
Yeah, and again, if anybody wants to get this, check the show notes for the audio feed, and it will be right there.

18:21.609 –> 18:21.809
All right.

18:22.189 –> 18:29.856
Now, you were saying Blackstone peeps are working seven days a week, but they may work a couple from home.

18:30.236 –> 18:37.642
But here you’re saying three-day office schedules are really reigning supreme, as they would say on TV, right?

18:37.682 –> 18:38.103
Oops, sorry.

18:38.803 –> 18:42.666
Yeah, so we wrote an article on CoStar.

18:42.826 –> 18:45.889
This company, Challenger Day and Christmas, is the research company.

18:45.929 –> 18:49.611
And they asked, okay, so if you’re in the office, how often are you in the office?

18:49.631 –> 18:51.253
And they asked that in the spring and in the fall.

18:51.633 –> 18:58.098
And you can clearly see here that the amount of people who are working three days in the office is up.

18:58.118 –> 19:02.621
So a third of the respondents are now working on a 3-2 hybrid schedule.

19:02.681 –> 19:06.344
The amount of people working zero days is down, working one day is down.

19:07.045 –> 19:08.546
Five days is up a little bit.

19:08.626 –> 19:09.767
So it’s going to be interesting to see.

19:09.987 –> 19:12.670
But I think there’s a clear shift from two days to three days.

19:13.211 –> 19:19.978
And you saw, I think, UPS, I think, just announced back five days in the office.

19:19.998 –> 19:25.524
So I think you’re going to see more companies saying, look, guys, we have all this office space.

19:25.884 –> 19:27.366
Let’s use it.

19:27.666 –> 19:30.389
And so maybe 3.2 is going to be the new normal.

19:31.950 –> 19:33.152
It’s, it’s fascinating.

19:33.352 –> 19:37.236
And I’ve said this before, but go back four or five years, right?

19:37.296 –> 19:38.617
Not, not even go back.

19:38.958 –> 19:39.198
Yeah.

19:39.298 –> 19:40.540
Four or five years, three years.

19:41.320 –> 19:48.568
And that graph would, people would look at you like heroin or cocaine.

19:48.608 –> 19:49.769
What is your drug of choice?

19:50.985 –> 19:51.665
Absolutely.

19:52.186 –> 19:54.987
The mind has shifted.

19:55.228 –> 19:56.989
The field of working has shifted.

19:57.269 –> 19:59.830
We’re all on Zoom and Teams and whatever all the time.

19:59.870 –> 20:01.331
We were taught during the pandemic.

20:01.751 –> 20:04.393
And now, you know, it’s really hard to put the genie back in the bottle.

20:05.194 –> 20:13.759
I think we’re going to see sort of a concerted effort of tenants, CEOs saying, look, I’m paying all this rent.

20:14.259 –> 20:15.780
I want people back in the office.

20:16.320 –> 20:19.362
But I’m not sure that five days is a thing.

20:19.946 –> 20:24.372
Yeah, I think five days, that would be difficult.

20:25.093 –> 20:34.324
However, like I’ve said before, I just don’t know how you build pride and you build teams when you’re not in the office with your colleagues.

20:34.905 –> 20:35.185
Again,

20:35.746 –> 21:00.455
three days four days but when you have one day in the office it’s not good you just can’t build the the and then also the people that decide you know what i’m going to be in the office four days right the only to get promoted faster than the person that’s working one day and more work in a hotel unless they can show extreme amount of separation in workload and and and improvement

21:01.435 –> 21:04.757
Um, but again, being, you know, we’re, we all, we all want it.

21:05.397 –> 21:06.798
We all want to be around each other.

21:06.858 –> 21:11.760
Even when we say we don’t, we are humans that need that human interaction.

21:12.381 –> 21:17.123
And so I think, I think it’s going to definitely increase three days this year.

21:17.143 –> 21:18.904
I think you’re going to see the four days.

21:19.024 –> 21:22.666
I don’t think you’re going to see, I think the five days of anything is going to go down.

21:22.686 –> 21:24.187
I think five days is gone.

21:25.083 –> 21:26.985
Yeah, let’s look back at that slide again.

21:27.005 –> 21:32.150
Yeah, five days has increased a little bit, which is a surprise.

21:32.190 –> 21:33.010
Just a little bit.

21:34.091 –> 21:38.295
I think it’s going to go down this year because I’m hearing… I could be wrong.

21:38.696 –> 21:40.077
I’ve been wrong a lot of times, Glenn.

21:40.677 –> 21:43.800
I’m partners with you, so how right can I be?

21:43.820 –> 21:43.980
The…

21:44.801 –> 21:50.323
So I’m just hearing a lot of people moving on when they have to be five days.

21:50.383 –> 21:51.443
They’re getting more money.

21:51.463 –> 21:52.844
They’re working three or four days from home.

21:53.204 –> 21:54.525
So I’m really accepting of people.

21:54.965 –> 21:59.506
So listen, I understand that people want to be in the office, that they want them in the office five days.

21:59.967 –> 22:03.188
But I see a slowing of that, but I could be wrong, completely wrong.

22:03.528 –> 22:04.788
It’s just basically what I’m seeing.

22:04.808 –> 22:05.449
Yeah.

22:07.469 –> 22:08.750
So here’s a theory.

22:08.770 –> 22:11.852
I have nothing to prove this yet, but here’s a thought.

22:13.052 –> 22:19.797
So what if we’re in the office three days and we’ve arranged our life around being not in the office Mondays and Fridays?

22:19.897 –> 22:22.778
And Fridays we walk the kids to school and Mondays we have the dog room or whatever.

22:23.239 –> 22:26.561
And so our life is sort of now on these three days we’re in the office.

22:27.301 –> 22:31.324
Are we then also subconsciously changing our travel patterns?

22:32.104 –> 22:35.406
Are we then saying, I can’t really travel Mondays and Fridays.

22:35.487 –> 22:37.848
I’m really only traveling on those three.

22:37.908 –> 22:41.991
Are we crunching a five-day travel week into three days for corporate transit?

22:42.531 –> 22:46.414
And then are we adding to that all the group travelers?

22:47.214 –> 22:55.860
And does that then mean that for those three nights or two nights, Wednesday, that we’re going to suddenly see compression and higher room rate growth than what we’re projecting?

22:56.000 –> 22:58.622
Again, I’m making this up, but I’m pondering.

22:59.042 –> 22:59.923
I don’t think you’re making it up.

23:00.244 –> 23:06.872
I think you’re basing it on what we’re actually seeing happen in society anecdotally there for sure.

23:07.332 –> 23:07.633
All right.

23:07.833 –> 23:09.074
So occupancy midweek.

23:09.275 –> 23:11.417
You have a chart here steady as she goes.

23:11.477 –> 23:13.540
How does this play into your philosophy?

23:14.107 –> 23:25.099
Yeah, so what I just said hasn’t played out yet, but I wonder if in 2024, when we have this conversation again a year from now, well, whatever, six months from now, if there’s something there.

23:25.379 –> 23:33.628
I think the interesting thing here is that the weekend leisure piece has just been a little weaker all year, and I think this goes back to this idea of normalization.

23:40.151 –> 23:42.252
Yeah, I think you’re right about that.

23:43.232 –> 23:49.595
A few years ago, it was like everything was busy Thursday to Tuesday, completely like the opposite of what things have been.

23:49.615 –> 23:51.055
I’m looking at this.

23:51.095 –> 23:58.618
It looks like, according to you, occupancy is down a little bit all around, but not that midweek Monday to Wednesday.

23:59.139 –> 24:06.842
So I guess that plays into the group business going up, more people in corporate getting back to it and being on the road.

24:06.882 –> 24:07.882
Is that correct?

24:07.902 –> 24:09.763
Yeah, that’s exactly the way I would look at it.

24:10.143 –> 24:10.563
All right, cool.

24:40.667 –> 24:43.811
What are the numbers telling you about where we are today?

24:45.182 –> 25:01.191
Well, I’m flaming you for calling us old, but you’re totally correct that the interest rate environment that we’ve had for the last couple of years was basically free money and there was no bad idea, you know, and now interest rates are up.

25:01.251 –> 25:09.176
And so what we’re seeing in the pipeline data is that the number of rooms in construction is basically flat and has been flat for literally the last two years or so.

25:09.276 –> 25:10.897
So it’s like between 150 and 160,000 rooms in construction.

25:12.958 –> 25:16.421
What that flat means is that the rooms that open are back still.

25:16.521 –> 25:18.082
Some projects are breaking ground.

25:18.102 –> 25:19.363
It’s just not a whole lot.

25:19.403 –> 25:21.384
And you see the final planning number is up 20%.

25:21.904 –> 25:23.245
That’s pretty good.

25:23.265 –> 25:31.291
So what that to me means is that somebody has land, somebody has a brand, and now they go to the bank and say, hey, give me a construction loan.

25:31.751 –> 25:34.753
And the bank’s like, yeah, and it costs you whatever the number is.

25:34.773 –> 25:36.395
And they’re like, whoa, that’s a lot.

25:36.955 –> 25:42.259
And I then have to think about once I’m opening, I have to take out that construction loan.

25:42.339 –> 25:42.499
Right.

25:42.959 –> 25:45.520
What is the interest rate then on the regular mortgage?

25:45.600 –> 25:48.162
And man, maybe I’m just going to sit back for a minute.

25:48.602 –> 25:59.087
And I think because the Federal Reserve has indicated that we are now at peak rate and they’re going to start taking interest rates down, that I think is going to make a lot of people very interested in breaking ground.

25:59.507 –> 26:09.451
So do I, as a developer, go, well, I could get my loan and break ground in February, but now that I know that the Fed’s going to drop rates throughout the year, maybe I’ll wait till August.

26:09.671 –> 26:10.952
Do you think that’s a possibility?

26:12.845 –> 26:19.711
Maybe, but I think a lot of people are saying, look, I don’t care about the construction loan.

26:20.471 –> 26:24.114
I’m interested in the long-term loan, and that’s going to be lower than what I have today.

26:24.595 –> 26:24.975
Let’s go.

26:25.335 –> 26:26.396
All right.

26:26.416 –> 26:27.217
That makes sense to me.

26:27.938 –> 26:29.299
I like that theory.

26:29.379 –> 26:31.300
Anthony, you got any questions on this particular?

26:31.881 –> 26:33.562
No, that makes perfect sense.

26:33.842 –> 26:37.866
And listen, at the end of the day, you’re going to make more money if you go now than if you wait.

26:39.685 –> 26:41.567
Don’t want to miss the boat.

26:41.587 –> 26:42.708
That’s always the way it is.

26:42.728 –> 26:54.318
And that’s why I’m going to harp on this theme all year because I know they’re going to start saying it, Alice, Jan, where everybody’s going to claim that they’re hesitant about doing stuff because of the political environment because we’re in an election year.

26:54.798 –> 26:59.743
I just want to say I think that they say that stuff to get other people not to do deals, right?

27:00.063 –> 27:00.283
Yeah.

27:00.323 –> 27:00.864
All right.

27:03.925 –> 27:05.846
We’ll be busy.

27:05.866 –> 27:10.786
The chart here we’re showing is quarterly transaction volume in billions of dollars.

27:12.347 –> 27:13.867
The fourth quarter data just came out.

27:14.107 –> 27:17.488
We sold roughly $6 billion or so.

27:17.508 –> 27:18.068
That’s down.

27:19.428 –> 27:24.989
The number got revised a little bit, but call it down 50%, 55% from a year ago.

27:25.629 –> 27:29.910
I don’t see a catalyst for Q1, a lot of transactions, but absolutely…

27:30.770 –> 27:43.014
My indicator, and you probably have your own little indicator, but my non-data indicator that I use is how busy is the walkway between the JW and the Starbucks and the Alice Conference.

27:43.194 –> 27:47.095
If you can’t get through, that means, man, we are really rocking and rolling.

27:47.435 –> 27:51.641
And I think that area around the Starbucks is going to be very busy in two weeks.

27:51.942 –> 27:57.009
People are just laying the groundwork and getting ready to transact in 2024.

27:57.209 –> 28:00.574
Not in Q1, but I definitely think that’s going to be an uptick.

28:01.073 –> 28:05.395
So where the Atlas Conference takes place, there’s a courtyard at the LA Live area.

28:05.415 –> 28:11.497
And if you go just behind the JW, right next to that in the courtyard area is that Starbucks.

28:11.537 –> 28:14.319
And it’s a natural place for, because LA’s got great weather.

28:14.359 –> 28:15.559
Everyone wants to be outside.

28:15.599 –> 28:17.340
It’s a natural place for everybody to hang out.

28:17.720 –> 28:25.963
And I’ll tell you, people start getting those little tables over there in a yard house next door really early and do a lot of deals over there.

28:26.184 –> 28:26.704
That’s for sure.

28:26.724 –> 28:26.964
Exactly.

28:27.544 –> 28:29.586
Jeff is asking, is this file available to access?

28:29.706 –> 28:40.955
Yes, I will be putting it up along with the audio feed this very afternoon as soon as I have an opportunity, right after I host something for our friends over at Hotel Business today.

28:41.816 –> 28:42.716
Okay, so…

28:43.998 –> 28:48.485
Next slide, CMBS delinquency rates.

28:48.525 –> 28:51.951
That was a huge issue that we were talking about throughout last year.

28:53.393 –> 28:57.581
When you look at this slide, how does that meet the expectations the industry was thinking in regards to it?

28:58.223 –> 29:00.764
I mean, really the story is that it’s not a story.

29:00.865 –> 29:04.767
I use the slide just to say, take a deep breath, we’re fine.

29:05.367 –> 29:09.770
Like the 5% number, delinquency number has been around for a while.

29:09.830 –> 29:11.591
And I don’t think that’s gonna change very much.

29:12.651 –> 29:24.258
Call it, stay alive to 25, extend and pretend, delay and pray, whatever your favorite bumper sticker is about this is you talk to your lender and you say, look, man,

29:25.618 –> 29:26.979
Just give me another extension.

29:26.999 –> 29:28.319
We can figure this out together.

29:28.639 –> 29:31.420
So I don’t expect that number to spike up.

29:31.980 –> 29:32.200
All right.

29:32.240 –> 29:33.381
I got a new one.

29:33.561 –> 29:35.281
I’m in a bind, so I’ll be blind.

29:35.401 –> 29:36.262
That’ll be my new one.

29:37.942 –> 29:38.742
All right.

29:38.763 –> 29:41.543
Going back to 2020 during COVID, there was a 20% delinquency rate.

29:45.331 –> 29:46.072
All right, hold on.

29:46.112 –> 29:46.853
Not all of it.

29:46.893 –> 29:51.117
So delinquent doesn’t mean the bank took the keys back.

29:51.157 –> 29:54.360
It just meant the owner was like, look, man, I can’t make this payment.

29:54.380 –> 29:58.384
We’re calling this delinquent because CMBS is very structured, as you know.

29:59.044 –> 30:03.108
You have to follow every I&T.

30:03.508 –> 30:06.932
And this was called delinquent.

30:07.292 –> 30:09.154
It then may have righted itself.

30:10.230 –> 30:27.341
And you see that the liquidity number came down pretty quickly after people got other mortgages or preferred equity or other sort of capital sources, or once just guests came back and people were able to make the debt payment again.

30:27.562 –> 30:28.022
Rough days.

30:28.427 –> 30:29.448
That makes perfect sense.

30:29.488 –> 30:41.259
So I might as well ask you, since we’re here, before we start to wrap up today and get to that last slide that you gave me, what do you think the sentiment is going to be when we convene in LA in a couple of weeks?

30:42.960 –> 30:53.269
I think because the Federal Reserve has indicated rate cuts, and depending on who you believe, it’s going to be March, April, or it’s going to be later in the year or whatever, but they’re going to be interest rates

30:58.678 –> 31:20.090
active ready at least now they can plan they know that the interest rates are not going to be higher than what they what we have today and that allows them to plan and go forward and underwrite and you know make deals or break around yep any insights on the uh transaction market we talked a little bit about new builds but what about properties trading hands

31:21.836 –> 31:28.641
Again, I’m not sure Q1 is going to see a whole lot, but I think after that we’re going to see healthy activity.

31:29.241 –> 31:29.661
Excellent.

31:30.062 –> 31:30.542
Anthony?

31:30.562 –> 31:40.769
Before we get to the last slide, can we go to the slide that showed the increase in average rates among different segments, among the luxury segment, discount segment?

31:40.789 –> 31:41.889
Can we just go to that slide?

31:41.909 –> 31:43.370
Yeah, that’s it.

31:43.390 –> 31:43.530
Okay.

31:44.591 –> 31:55.559
So I understand you explained the luxury upper scale, but the economy class and mid-scale, explain the theory behind that.

31:56.740 –> 31:57.721
Super interesting, right?

31:57.761 –> 32:10.131
So economy chains have seen occupancy decline, and that is actually better than what the underlying data is because we’ve seen supply taken out of inventory.

32:10.391 –> 32:12.953
So the demand is actually down more.

32:14.136 –> 32:15.157
On the economy side.

32:15.377 –> 32:18.019
Okay, so then why is that?

32:18.239 –> 32:21.062
Part of it is, of course, we’ve seen hotels close.

32:21.082 –> 32:22.663
That demand doesn’t exist anymore.

32:23.304 –> 32:24.945
Some hotels moved upmarket.

32:25.565 –> 32:28.628
Some travelers probably said, hey, I’m feeling pretty good.

32:28.688 –> 32:29.809
I have a very stable job.

32:29.869 –> 32:31.010
Unemployment rate is low.

32:31.110 –> 32:32.691
If I get fired, I get another job.

32:33.051 –> 32:36.214
Let me go mid-scale or upper mid-scale.

32:36.254 –> 32:37.055
Maybe trade up.

32:37.755 –> 32:43.480
So it’s still a little bit of a question mark why the economy segment is behaving the way it’s behaving.

32:43.700 –> 32:47.763
But I think a lot of it is just moving out to mid-scale or to independent.

32:48.904 –> 32:55.589
And was it just the uptick during COVID and right after COVID that the only place it has to go is down a little bit?

32:57.130 –> 32:58.111
Yeah, I think that’s part of it.

32:59.264 –> 33:00.085
Yeah.

33:00.145 –> 33:10.831
Interestingly enough, Dr. Producer Suzanne is saying, you know, we had yesterday Chip Rogers on, and we were talking about, for those that don’t know, the president and CEO of the American Hotel and Lodging Association.

33:10.911 –> 33:12.412
Check out that show now.

33:12.772 –> 33:18.836
But he was saying, we were talking a little bit about the Airbnb rule changes in New York City, banning them.

33:19.917 –> 33:25.460
Do you think we’ll see an increase in the hotel business in New York City because of this, or I should say business for hotel?

33:25.800 –> 33:27.881
hotels in New York City because of it?

33:28.081 –> 33:32.963
Or was it more of a leisure phenomenon and people just stay in Jersey or not bother coming?

33:33.003 –> 33:34.304
How do you think it’s going to play out?

33:35.264 –> 33:43.948
So I think there are three forces that will make New York City a city, the city maybe to watch in 2024.

33:44.189 –> 33:51.792
Number one, as you said, Airbnb short-term rentals are basically moved from one night to 30 nights or more.

33:52.752 –> 33:53.073
And so

33:54.233 –> 33:57.636
those leisure travelers will have to decide where they’re going to stay.

33:57.676 –> 33:59.097
Likely they’re going to have to use a hotel.

33:59.938 –> 34:03.400
Number two, the number of rooms in construction is still super high.

34:03.761 –> 34:11.406
But after that, once those 8,000 rooms open, the pipeline is not nil, but there’s not a lot coming.

34:11.767 –> 34:18.352
Because of the way that new hotels get authorized now, it’s super complicated and they’re definitely union.

34:18.752 –> 34:20.894
And so the mid-block limited service hotel

34:21.554 –> 34:24.418
It’s basically no longer existing.

34:25.138 –> 34:32.467
Mr. de Blasio fixed that problem, or actually made that problem when he signed that legislation.

34:32.487 –> 34:40.977
That made it very difficult for hotels to develop in the city without going through, we’ll just say, certain channels.

34:41.778 –> 34:43.420
And that’s going to be with us for a long time.

34:43.560 –> 34:49.547
And number three, we have 16,000 rooms that we’re taking offline to house the unhoused migrants and refugees.

34:49.887 –> 34:54.153
Now, those were half-starred, the Yan Inn, whatever, you never want to stay in.

34:55.054 –> 34:55.674
Definitely not.

34:56.647 –> 35:03.073
But still, you know, that is demand in some instances that has to go upstream, you know, because some travelers did it.

35:03.113 –> 35:04.975
Some international inbound didn’t know what they were booking.

35:05.295 –> 35:07.076
Now they have to go a little bit higher.

35:07.096 –> 35:23.111
So I’m very bullish on New York and I’m bullish on New York City room rents, you know, and it’s going to be really interesting to see what how New York hoteliers are capitalizing on this quote unquote perfect storm of demand and supply constraint of supply constraint.

35:24.286 –> 35:24.626
Excellent.

35:24.986 –> 35:29.990
And I want to wrap up today by letting you show a little bit for you.

35:30.050 –> 35:33.972
And Isaac, you’ve got a data-related podcast over there.

35:34.072 –> 35:36.514
So Geeks Unite behind this one.

35:37.754 –> 35:40.936
If you find any of this interesting, join us once a month.

35:40.996 –> 35:42.898
It’s on Apple Podcasts, wherever you get your podcasts.

35:42.978 –> 35:45.659
Tell Me More, Hospitality Data Podcast.

35:45.699 –> 35:49.382
We like to call it not a lot of hair, but a lot of good data.

35:50.002 –> 35:53.344
So find us wherever you get your podcasts.

35:54.891 –> 35:57.313
Not a lot of brains, but a lot of big mouths.

36:00.475 –> 36:09.962
Just to wrap up tonight, I don’t know if this is a compliment or an insult from Polar Knights, but she’s saying about you two or he, I hope when I get as old as Jan and Anthony, I look as good.

36:10.002 –> 36:15.486
Does that mean I look absolutely horrible or I just look so much younger than those guys?

36:15.566 –> 36:15.986
I’d like to…

36:19.248 –> 36:28.210
I take it as that we’re old as dirt.

36:28.290 –> 36:30.471
Thank you so much for being here.

36:30.491 –> 36:31.811
I really appreciate it.

36:32.351 –> 36:33.491
And I’ll see you in LA.

36:33.771 –> 36:34.892
Anthony, do you want to say anything?

36:35.132 –> 36:41.073
This is critical information and I am sure people are going to be listening to the podcast and grabbing these slides.

36:41.713 –> 36:41.953
Yeah.

36:42.213 –> 36:42.934
Yeah.

36:43.134 –> 36:43.554
Sorry, Jan.

36:43.594 –> 36:44.214
I hit the wrong button.

36:44.234 –> 36:45.255
Thank you so much.

36:45.475 –> 36:46.755
We’ll see you later.

36:47.195 –> 36:47.656
All right.

36:47.676 –> 36:48.416
Be well.

36:48.796 –> 36:55.199
Man, what a powerhouse week this has been for the information we’re getting here on the show.

36:55.219 –> 36:55.979
You know what?

36:56.139 –> 36:58.160
I have two commitments during Alice.

36:58.180 –> 37:03.883
I was like, I’m going to fly out to Alice after my speaking gig because I was like, I’m going to have to go back up to Boston.

37:04.824 –> 37:06.025
I’m sorry.

37:06.045 –> 37:07.127
I’m going to miss it this year.

37:07.147 –> 37:11.773
It’s probably the most important conferences of the year, if not the most important.

37:12.354 –> 37:20.165
And so I was, you know, well, just bring back all the information and, you know, make sure I get that slideshow, buddy.

37:20.585 –> 37:21.225
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

37:21.266 –> 37:21.806
I’ll do it right.

37:21.946 –> 37:22.926
I’ll do it right now.

37:23.427 –> 37:24.367
Don’t you worry about that.

37:24.387 –> 37:29.930
And for all of you, I don’t want you to worry about anything out there because if you want, download our audio podcast.

37:29.950 –> 37:32.291
Get it where, you know, you’re already getting your own podcast.

37:32.311 –> 37:35.033
If you’re not subscribed on iTunes, get ours as well.

37:35.053 –> 37:37.374
We’re also wherever you get your podcasts.

37:37.414 –> 37:39.495
And in the show notes will be a link to this graph.

37:40.035 –> 37:42.537
Obviously, you can just reach out to Yann at CoStar yourself.

37:42.797 –> 37:44.498
If you want to watch us, we’re on Facebook.

37:44.698 –> 37:50.282
We’re on Instagram, LinkedIn, NoVacancyNews on YouTube, and, of course, at NoVacancyNews.com.

37:50.322 –> 37:51.702
I want to thank everyone for being here.

37:52.303 –> 37:56.125
I’ve got to do a thing for hotel business now on 2024 Trends.

37:56.145 –> 37:57.166
We’ve got a great panel.

37:57.186 –> 37:58.367
Go to HotelBusiness.com.

37:58.407 –> 37:59.728
Not too late to register.

38:00.048 –> 38:04.711
Tomorrow night, we’ve got the incredible Sarah Dandeshi on Friday Night Audit.

38:04.731 –> 38:05.611
Come have some drinks with us.

38:05.711 –> 38:07.853
Have a couple of laughs at Producer Dave’s expense.

38:08.493 –> 38:10.134
And that’s it.

38:10.274 –> 38:11.835
Listen, don’t corrupt young minds.

38:13.695 –> 38:14.596
All right, everybody.

38:14.616 –> 38:18.218
Remember, you’ve got one life, so blaze on and be kind to yourself.

38:18.298 –> 38:19.238
See you all next week.

38:19.558 –> 38:20.078
Be well.

38:20.499 –> 38:21.299
What the hell, Stitcher?