Chip Rogers, President & CEO of the AHLA, gives an update on the state of industry, the NLRB’s joint employer rule, and the NJ franchise bill amongst other topics.

Video Transcript

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So today you’re in a hotel in Boston.

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Yesterday I was in a hotel in Boston.

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Why are we never in Boston together?

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I was in Washington, D.C., blocks away from our guest’s office, and I didn’t stop in because I thought he was somewhere in the world.

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I will just say it is our favorite guest of the show.

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Sorry, everybody.

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Well, let’s find out who it is.

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I’m Anthony.

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Welcome to No Vacancy Live.

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That’s my friend Glenn.

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You’re watching the number one show in hospitality.

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Hey everybody, welcome to the one and only No Vacancy Live.

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Of course, that’s Anthony Melchiorri back with us today.

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I’m still Glenn Hausman.

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Thank you all for joining us.

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So excited to see you today, Anthony.

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Welcome back.

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Well, thank you.

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Unfortunately, at 12 o’clock yesterday, I was somewhere on 95 South in a snowstorm.

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Yeah, I drove home in that last night, but it just turned to treacherous rain.

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So that was that was a whole lot of fun.

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But I’ll tell you, we’re just kind of kidding on that.

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But one thing that is fun is we’re going to be going.

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I’m going to be going out to the Alice conference in a couple of weeks and we’re going to get the scoop on what’s going to be going on for 2024.

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So today we’re going to get a little preview of stuff.

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We’re going to be looking at legislative issues.

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that are going on, going here in our incredible business.

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And then tomorrow, a little show note, we’re going to have Jan Freitag on from CoStar STR to give us what he sees in the numbers.

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But Anthony, as much as I love talking to you and I want to catch up, we’ve got such a great guest today.

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Before we invite our guest on,

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I’m going to say this without him being on because I don’t want to embarrass him and him say stop it.

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There is no greater leader for our industry than the gentleman that’s about to come on.

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He has done more in the last several years for our industry than anyone has done probably in the last 20 years.

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And anybody that wants to take me to task on that, I think there’s a report card that I will win that argument.

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All right.

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And as our good improv skills rules tell us, yes, and I agree with you.

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And it’s amazing to see how much has been done with the American Hotel and Lodging Association.

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They’re growing.

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They’re expanding.

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They’re doing a lot more to help our community.

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Let’s welcome to the show, President and CEO, Chip Rogers.

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So great to see you, Chip.

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Gentlemen, good to see you.

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Anthony, I’ll pay you later.

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You’re a great guy.

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He’s the best voice.

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I mean, Glenn, no disrespect, but Anthony is the loudest cheerleader.

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So it goes goes Anthony Glenn one and one.

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But you guys just do an incredible job.

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And I, too, am excited to get out to Los Angeles because the weather here sucks.

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Yeah.

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Yeah, it sure does.

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But hey, that’s one of the risks you take living in Washington, D.C., making all things happen for us.

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I think what we’re going to do today is we’re going to take a look at all the legislative issues that I saw.

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So the first one that’s really important that’s been pressing and kind of bothering a lot of folks in our industry is what has been going on with New Jersey.

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It looks like we have a serious update on that particular issue, Chip.

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Yeah, the New Jersey legislature adjourned without passing any legislation in and around hotel franchising.

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And so that’s good because the underlying issue at hand was a piece of legislation that targeted the hotel industry.

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Now, first and foremost, we stand against legislation that targets the hotel industry in a negative way.

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And that’s exactly what this bill did.

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And we would hope that everyone in the industry,

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Every association, every hotelier, whether you’re an owner, you’re a brand, you’re a management company, would stand against legislation targeting the industry because once you get the government involved in your business, your daily operations, it’s not like they’re going to leave.

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I mean, no one ever said, you know what?

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I got a problem.

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I should get the government involved in my business, and that would really help solve my problem.

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It just doesn’t work.

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And so the underlying principle of targeting our industry was a bad idea.

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And then when you looked at the specifics,

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They weren’t really well thought out.

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There’s a lot of language in that legislation that would have done some hyper damaging things.

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For example, there was a just just to I don’t want to part 10 things we could go into.

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One example is part of the legislation said you have a protected area around a hotel.

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Everybody understands that if I own a Holiday Inn Express, they shouldn’t be allowed to build another one within my protected area.

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That’s common sense.

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That’s the standard.

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That’s the way it’s always been.

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What this bill would have done was take that expanded protection area and apply it to all hotels in that entire brand.

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So let’s say you had, yeah, let’s say you did have that Holiday Inn Express.

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It would prevent you from building an Intercontinental in that same protected area, which makes no sense whatsoever because the guests for the Intercontinental and the guests for the Holiday Inn Express are quite different.

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So that’s just one example, but it doesn’t.

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At the end of the day, it actually hurts you because that hotel will help your hotel.

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Absolutely.

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It’s going to drive more people into that industry for meetings and things like that.

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So it actually hurts you.

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And, you know, you have to allow companies to negotiate themselves.

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You don’t want the referee, the government to be the referee.

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Right.

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Yeah, we have enough problems with referees.

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You don’t want the government to come in and be your referee.

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So listen, companies got to get there on their own.

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And sometimes there’s a lot of stress and a lot of arguments and a lot of disagreement.

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But at the end of the day, there’s negotiation that usually works out for both parties.

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Yeah, and that’s what you do.

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You settle this at the table.

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I mean, ask the Detroit Lions what referees are like, right?

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So you don’t.

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And it’s just, again, like I said from the beginning, no one ever said, hey, I want to solve my business problem.

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Let me get the government involved.

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That’s just not a good idea because once they get in, they’re not getting out.

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And then when it targets the hotel industry, it’s even worse.

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And so we’re going to continue to make sure we’re protecting the franchise model for owners, for brands, for management companies.

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I remind people again and again and again.

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You know, my chair of AHLA for the last two years has been hotel owners, and they steadfastly stood against this legislation because they knew ultimately it wasn’t good for hotel owners.

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And so we’ll continue to work with the author of the bill.

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He’s now moved over from the House to the Senate in New Jersey and hopefully find some sort of conclusion to where this can be settled outside the bounds of legislation.

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Yeah.

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Now, one area also looks like you’ve you’ve had some success is the craziness that was going on in L.A.

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with forcing hotels to put homeless in there, who many of which may be mentally ill and not the image that we’d like to see of like a single mom trying to get housing.

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Well, look, you know, Glenn and Anthony, the reality is homeless is a serious problem in almost every community across this country.

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What was proposed in Los Angeles was not a serious answer.

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In fact, it was a dangerous suggestion because it not only put guests at danger, it put hotel employees at danger.

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And that’s what that’s where I just kind of shook my head.

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I mean, I sometimes find that the the union doesn’t really care about the guests.

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union leadership i should say not the union members themselves they clearly do but the union leadership doesn’t care they don’t really care about the business but they ought to at least care about their own union members and the safety of those members and this ridiculous plan would have put them in danger and so you know we did a lot of work on this pointing out how dangerous it was to hotel employees asking that question again and again why would the union put their own members at physical danger and then we went out and asked consumers and said look would you come to los angeles if this were the law

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And overwhelmingly, they said, no, we won’t visit Los Angeles.

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So I think it finally dawned on the leaders there in Los Angeles that this was not going to work.

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It was a very bad idea and it would destroy the hotel industry.

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Yeah, I’m also not a big fan of cities abdicating their responsibility to take care of their populations, right?

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I mean, if they can’t create affordable housing, if they can’t provide strong mental health professionals to aid individuals, and I walk around downtown LA, I see it in New York, some very mentally ill people.

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If the jurisdictions can’t handle that, it’s not up to the responsibility of a private business to get involved.

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And listen, we want everyone to be helped because, as I say, the grace of God go I. Right.

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Any of us could be in any situation at any time.

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So no one’s above any of that.

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However, as you said, Chip, it puts everybody in danger.

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And I said you would shut down L.A.

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You would literally shut it down.

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There would not be one group, one convention, one business.

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Because I know I’m not staying in a hotel like that because not only it’s putting the employees and the customers, it’s putting them at risk.

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Because you don’t know how somebody is going to react to something that maybe seem minor.

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You know, they don’t work.

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Maybe they don’t live in urban environments.

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And they’re not used to maybe dealing with people that they see like that.

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So it’s dangerous for everyone.

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And just in a few seconds, can you for people that don’t understand what we’re talking about, what was the plan?

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Yeah, it was one of the most cockamamie ideas you could ever hear of.

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So if it would have passed, this was going to be a ballot measure, and the union thankfully pulled it off the ballot.

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But if it would have passed, it would require every hotelier in the city of Los Angeles at 2 p.m.

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every day to call City Hall.

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Now, we can all just think about just that first step alone seems a little ridiculous, right?

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How often are you able to call City Hall and get through?

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But at 2 o’clock, you’d have to do that, and you would have to report how many rooms you have available,

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and what your rate is at that time.

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Of course, not recognizing that rates can change throughout the day.

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Once the city gathered all that information from all the hoteliers in Los Angeles, they would then go to homeless areas, whether those be shelters or underneath bridges, I’m not sure how they were planning to do that, and hand out vouchers.

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The person experiencing homelessness would then take that voucher and go to any hotel that they wanted and use that voucher for a night stay.

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And so it would have just been a ridiculous problem.

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Just think about this as well.

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What happens in day two?

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The voucher is good for one night.

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What happens on the second night?

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You think the homeless person is going to leave that nice hotel room they’re in?

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And then how do you how do you enforce that?

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Well, then you’re going to have to call law enforcement.

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You think L.A.

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law enforcement does that have anything better to do than to go over to hotels and take homeless people out of the hotel because their voucher expired?

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I mean, it was just silly on its face.

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And the fact that anyone gave this any serious consideration tells us.

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How bad we are with the electorate in today, because you can come up with the most ridiculous idea and somehow people glom onto that because there’s some sort of visceral emotional reaction to wanting to solve the homeless problem, which we all do.

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But that doesn’t mean that every solution is a good solution.

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You wrote that into a script and the producer would throw it in the garbage.

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It’s like that doesn’t make any sense.

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No one would ever do that.

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And you don’t solve any problems, but you create 600,000 more problems.

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So you don’t even create the problem.

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You don’t even fix the problem you’re trying to fix.

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You don’t fix it.

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You just you create more.

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And when I first heard of it, I actually was losing sleep over.

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I was like, this can’t happen like this.

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Then it’s going to come to New York.

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It’s going to come.

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And then I said to myself, I knew you guys were all over it.

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I was like, this can’t happen.

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And I’m glad it’s not even on the ballot to even the ridiculousness of voting for it.

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Yeah, I think what this really comes is the crux of is that jurisdictions feel they can continue to rely on the hotel business to solve problems, whether it’s something as crazy like this or continuing to increase occupancy taxes and make it more difficult for these businesses to succeed.

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And I think, Chip, that this still comes down to, even after all the great work you do, because congressional representatives keep flipping over, I don’t think people genuinely understand how hotels are really

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impacting the American economy and how they are important for the backbone of jobs and taxes.

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Yeah, we want out of every 25 jobs in America is somehow tied to a hotel, whether that be directly working at the hotel, working off property or working for a company that provides goods and services to that hotel.

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And so we have an enormous fiscal impact in every single community in America.

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And that should be noted.

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And, you know, you just have to look.

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The reality is for elected officials, just use some common sense, just like fiscal

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Think about the things that you’re doing in a way that makes sense in application, not just makes sense for the news headline you want to get, not just in some way pacify the crazy group that’s asking you to do something, but think about, does this actually work?

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I’ll give you another example.

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We’re dealing with this right now.

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There’s a ton of cities across the US that are considering all sorts of penalties for carbon emissions of buildings, right?

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Commercial buildings.

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I think we all want to solve the carbon emission problem.

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But when you apply a penalty to someone who cannot control the solution or cannot control the activity that you’re penalizing, you’ve set up a scenario that just doesn’t work.

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For example, let’s say you’re let’s say the both of you are in a car right now and let’s say Glenn’s driving and you’re going 100 miles an hour down 95 and Glenn gets pulled over and the officer walks up and hands Anthony the ticket and say, Anthony, you know, I’m going to give you the ticket because Glenn was driving the car.

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I like that.

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In the hotel industry, we can’t control what temperature the guest sets the room on.

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We can’t control how much water they use.

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These are not things that are in our control.

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And to then penalize us for the activities of somebody else makes no sense whatsoever.

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Now, can we all take actions to make more water-efficient utilities, make better systems for energy using, not having food waste?

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We can do all that.

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We at HLA support that.

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We have guides for that.

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but you can’t control the activities of the guest down to the micro level.

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No, in fact, I would argue that it’s up to those jurisdictions to provide some carrots to make the change.

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So people will be prompted to make that change as opposed to saying you have to, or else that’s just a strong arm tactics.

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Anthony, sorry.

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Go off on a tangent, but let’s go off on a tangent.

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How the hell did we get here?

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How did we get to like, there’s always been ridiculous legislation, right?

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This is like the Hall of Fame of ridiculous legislation.

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How did we, and I always say, you know, we’re the youngest, we have the oldest constitution in the youngest country.

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So we don’t have a lot of years, right?

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We only have a couple hundred years.

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But in our history, I don’t remember anything.

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Things like this ever happening that it’s literally it’s like somebody that went in to make these bills that have no sense of of what’s going on on either side.

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They’re doing it just like you said, for shock value and for headlines.

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How the heck did we get here?

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Because there’s probably 12 more coming down the path this week.

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Yeah, look, there’s a lot to this.

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And I know that this is a hospitality related show, so I won’t spend too much time on it.

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But, you know, you have to ask yourself when you’re looking at who you’re voting for.

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First of all, you can’t believe 90 percent of the things that are printed or I mean, every every campaign is now nothing but attacks.

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You’re very little on the actual issues that impact people.

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And what that means is, is the best and brightest in our community are not going to run for public office.

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When we were kids, you guys recall, you know, it was the local doctor, it was the local lawyer, it was the local CPA who said, I want to give back to my community and provide some public service after I’ve been successful.

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These are thoughtful, well-reasoned people who don’t have an ax to grind.

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They instead just wanna help their community.

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Those people are gone.

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And the reason they’re gone is because they’re not going to put themselves in the way of the shotgun approach of politics now in which everything is the most ridiculous attack.

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But the problem is, is that we’ve been emotionally driven into two camps.

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And when I say that, it is a camp that says anything and everything that Donald Trump says is wrong and I hate him and anybody that’s near him I hate.

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Or the other side, anything and everything that Joe Biden says is wrong and I hate him and I’m going to vote.

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And we can’t allow ourselves to do that.

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But that is exactly the camps we’ve been driven into.

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And it’s not a logical process.

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Like I could probably name for you five great things that Joe Biden has done as president.

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Probably name you five great things that Donald Trump did as president.

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But the other sides will never acknowledge that because of a visceral hatred for the person.

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And we see that play out all the way through the political spectrum where the average good person is never going to subject themselves to that.

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And when we don’t have good people in political life,

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I mean, think about the wisdom of our forefathers, what they represented.

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Point to me anyone in America today that applies that same sort of wisdom.

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I mean, these were the true leaders that truly thought about stuff.

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What were the implications of policy?

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It just doesn’t exist anymore.

17:01.229 –> 17:04.832
Well, they didn’t have TikTok, so they weren’t distracted as much.

17:05.813 –> 17:09.576
What’s fascinating is most of us fall in the middle, right?

17:10.563 –> 17:12.024
Most of us want affordable healthcare.

17:12.044 –> 17:13.225
We want affordable housing.

17:13.245 –> 17:14.606
We want everybody to be taken care of.

17:14.986 –> 17:16.107
We want competition.

17:16.447 –> 17:21.290
We want people to basically make as much money as they can make as long as they’re doing it in a moral way.

17:21.611 –> 17:23.192
We want to take care of people.

17:23.512 –> 17:24.753
So we all fall in the middle.

17:25.653 –> 17:55.042
um we’re not all of us but a lot of us and if we just have a conversation even if you’re polar opposite of my opinion we probably can get to the middle of the conversation but everybody listen how many times have you clicked on something and the headline is one thing and you click on it’s like that has nothing to do with the headline 90 of the time well look another perfect example it’s one that impacts our industry immigration reform okay 95 of reasonable people which i think is about 80 of the country

17:56.249 –> 18:08.359
If you went to them and said, look, we have to be able to have enough people coming into the country who want to experience the American dream, who can fuel our economy because we need a growing economy, especially in a world where we have this much debt.

18:08.399 –> 18:09.840
We’ve got to grow our way out of it.

18:10.701 –> 18:13.183
And the only way to do that is combine productivity and labor.

18:13.203 –> 18:17.807
And if you don’t have labor, I don’t care how much productivity increase you have, it’s going to be very difficult to grow that economy.

18:18.007 –> 18:23.432
So you have to have more people coming in, especially when just the last job support showed us at about 2.6 million jobs

18:25.234 –> 18:27.696
between the number of openings and the number of people who are unemployed.

18:28.337 –> 18:30.699
So most people would say, yes, we have to have that.

18:31.300 –> 18:33.222
And we ought to know who is coming in.

18:33.362 –> 18:36.326
Like we got to be able to have a secure border.

18:36.386 –> 18:39.889
Almost everybody you talk to left and right would say, yes, that is a reasonable policy.

18:40.290 –> 18:46.336
And yet here we are 20 something years later, 25, almost 30 years later, since the last time we passed major reform,

18:46.997 –> 18:47.877
And we still don’t have that.

18:48.317 –> 19:00.661
And it’s just mind boggling that we have allowed the crazies to dictate something as important as immigration policy into a country that was built on the idea of immigration.

19:00.981 –> 19:02.422
It’s just ridiculous.

19:03.082 –> 19:05.004
And we’re dealing with that in a lot of big cities.

19:05.024 –> 19:05.944
We’re dealing with it in New York.

19:06.004 –> 19:14.090
And in my community, they built an area in a state park, and it’s probably 10 minutes from our home.

19:14.830 –> 19:18.753
And I heard that, hey, you can drop off jackets, you can drop off supplies.

19:19.233 –> 19:19.874
To support them.

19:19.914 –> 19:20.815
And we were so excited.

19:21.256 –> 19:23.278
We were like, yes, OK, we’ll bring everything.

19:23.318 –> 19:25.060
We’ll support them whenever we can do it.

19:25.080 –> 19:28.323
I spent six months in Honduras, so I know how things get down there.

19:28.864 –> 19:30.325
So I was all excited.

19:30.465 –> 19:37.813
But then what happens is they’re not giving them the resources they need and controlling them the way that it protects everyone.

19:38.074 –> 19:39.756
So now they’re knocking on doors.

19:40.316 –> 19:41.537
Oh, God.

19:42.017 –> 19:43.077
Asking for supplies.

19:43.778 –> 19:53.182
Well, that’s not good because the people that were against the immigration reform just doubled down and people like me to support it, but they have to do it in a smart way.

19:53.543 –> 19:55.844
And if we can’t accept them, we shouldn’t accept them.

19:56.164 –> 19:58.805
But if they do accept them, we should be able to control it.

19:59.265 –> 20:00.506
So I can’t agree with you more.

20:00.526 –> 20:04.048
I didn’t mean to go off on this tangent, but I think it’s important simply because.

20:04.788 –> 20:12.770
the asinine legislation that’s getting put into place without people like you, without your organizations, some of this stuff can slip through.

20:13.850 –> 20:15.251
Yeah, absolutely.

20:15.271 –> 20:18.991
And we have to continue to fight the ridiculousness of many of it, of many of these items.

20:19.051 –> 20:25.393
But it really all stems back to that core principle of how do we elect good, reasonable people?

20:25.533 –> 20:33.875
And where do we find those people in a contentious environment where you know the moment you put your name on the ballot, you know, they’re going to say 100 things about you and 95 of them are going to be false.

20:35.286 –> 20:37.629
Well, in my case, 99 would probably be.

20:38.249 –> 20:42.494
What was the guy from New York, from Long Island that just got thrown out of Congress?

20:42.834 –> 20:43.355
Oh, Santos.

20:43.375 –> 20:43.955
George Santos.

20:44.236 –> 20:44.396
Yeah.

20:44.416 –> 20:45.137
100% of the things were.

20:48.434 –> 20:50.175
Although I heard he’s a great volleyball player.

20:50.535 –> 20:57.836
All right, so I don’t know whether or not to segue into more on labor or that ridiculousness.

20:57.876 –> 21:00.857
I think I’m going to settle on the ridiculousness.

21:01.157 –> 21:10.979
The Labor Department is now exerting more regulations by apparently changing the way workers are classified as independent contractors or employees.

21:11.339 –> 21:15.960
I know California had some impact with this, and on the journalism side,

21:16.440 –> 21:25.005
seems to be a real mess this does it seems to be they’re going to be stepping in it and creating a lot of unanticipated issues maybe i’m wrong how do you see it sir

21:26.479 –> 21:30.340
Look, this just goes back to a core principle of what you think America should be about.

21:30.800 –> 21:33.161
And this comes down to control.

21:33.921 –> 21:39.023
So every state, certainly the federal government, has all sorts of laws as they pertain to employees.

21:39.443 –> 21:46.165
What we’ve seen the American people shift towards, not really, it’s a global shift, not just the American people, is a gig economy.

21:46.205 –> 21:53.567
Because people want to control their own destiny, and they’re willing to give up some of the protections that you might receive as an employee for that freedom.

21:54.527 –> 21:56.088
That’s the core of being America.

21:56.168 –> 22:02.472
I mean, yeah, we were all protected when we were back in the motherland in England, but we came to the United States because we wanted to live free.

22:03.092 –> 22:04.693
That’s what the gig economy represents.

22:05.193 –> 22:10.096
By their own actions, millions of people have said, look, I want to be an independent contractor.

22:10.116 –> 22:11.396
I want to work when I want to work.

22:11.757 –> 22:15.739
I don’t want to be tied to a single company or a single schedule or any of this.

22:15.799 –> 22:19.161
And if someone down the street offers me a better deal doing the same thing, I’m going to go do that.

22:19.781 –> 22:21.463
That’s where the American people are going.

22:21.543 –> 22:26.648
This ruling that just came out yesterday, or this proposed rule, is going the opposite direction.

22:26.688 –> 22:30.551
So right now, under current law, there’s what’s called a two-pronged test.

22:30.572 –> 22:35.096
So you have to meet two threshold to be classified as an independent contractor, 1099.

22:36.892 –> 22:40.054
This proposal takes that from two to six, triples it.

22:40.635 –> 22:50.041
And the idea is to make sure that people are not independent contractors so that there are actually employees so that they can be controlled by law.

22:50.261 –> 22:52.302
That is just not what the American people want.

22:52.383 –> 22:56.365
Again, it is a solution searching for a problem.

22:56.465 –> 22:58.487
We are going to try to find a way to stop this.

22:58.547 –> 23:02.229
If it takes legal action, we’re going to take that legal action among with many others.

23:02.289 –> 23:03.110
I can assure you of that.

23:03.630 –> 23:10.978
But then this is just another example of the Labor Department wanting to push everyone away from what the American people actually want.

23:12.321 –> 23:12.521
Right.

23:13.081 –> 23:17.584
And I think that we’ve got to keep our eyes really on this particular issue.

23:17.684 –> 23:26.908
I mean, I wouldn’t have the career I have today if I wasn’t able to be a contractor by contractor definitions that we’ve all kind of agreed upon over the last number of generations.

23:26.968 –> 23:27.148
Right.

23:27.389 –> 23:28.249
That’s how I started.

23:28.429 –> 23:36.993
And everybody here on No Vacancy are all contractors because I’m not going to tell somebody that they have to work from X hour to X hour.

23:37.053 –> 23:38.014
Do your job whenever.

23:38.074 –> 23:38.854
Just get it done.

23:39.254 –> 23:39.615
Period.

23:39.635 –> 23:39.895
The end.

23:40.535 –> 23:41.556
Look, it’s real simple.

23:41.596 –> 23:50.984
I mean, if someone says, especially early in your career, Glenn, that, all right, I want to hire, I want to pay Glenn to do a certain job.

23:51.304 –> 23:51.504
Right.

23:51.544 –> 23:52.125
You want to do it.

23:52.145 –> 23:54.507
And the person, the company is willing to pay you for that.

23:55.167 –> 23:56.608
You know, that’s an easy transaction.

23:56.668 –> 23:58.330
If they don’t like the job you’re doing.

23:58.590 –> 23:58.870
Right.

23:59.130 –> 23:59.551
You’re gone.

24:00.832 –> 24:02.793
If you were doing a great job, they’re going to pay you more.

24:02.833 –> 24:03.434
And it’s simple for them.

24:03.454 –> 24:04.054
It’s simple for you.

24:04.955 –> 24:13.207
If now they say, well, you know, I’ve got to hire Glenn and bring him on, go through all there, they’re a lot less likely to actually do that.

24:13.247 –> 24:15.410
So now you lose and they lose.

24:15.490 –> 24:16.852
It is a lose-lose proposition.

24:17.052 –> 24:21.398
Also, who’s the government to control my income over there?

24:21.578 –> 24:28.403
What if I want to work 24 hours a day and really maximize my opportunity and do a lot of contract work, right?

24:28.483 –> 24:33.987
Now you’re telling me I have to work for one company pretty much and, you know, listen to them.

24:34.167 –> 24:35.948
I don’t work well in those circumstances.

24:35.968 –> 24:38.570
But the government needs to take care of you though, Glenn, because you can’t be trusted.

24:38.690 –> 24:43.033
I was about to say, I’m going to rely on LA to put me up in swanky hotels every night at two o’clock in the afternoon.

24:43.093 –> 24:44.714
It’s interesting growing up in this industry.

24:45.555 –> 24:47.516
If you were a consultant, it means you got fired, right?

24:47.556 –> 24:48.376
You’re looking for a job.

24:48.816 –> 25:00.279
Now, because of technology, if you’re a consultant and you’re in the gig economy, like we are, it means because you want to be, not because you have to be.

25:00.539 –> 25:02.519
Whereas before, you didn’t have the technology.

25:02.539 –> 25:04.700
Like right now, I got my computer.

25:04.740 –> 25:05.400
I’m in a hotel room.

25:05.780 –> 25:32.661
and we can have this radio tv show whatever you want to call it because of technology so things have changed not only for the 25 year olds but for the 55 year olds you know and and some people like glenn said i played nice in the sandbox when i like the company that doesn’t play nice in the sandbox people who are very talented and very good at what they do but you don’t want them around all the time you want them to come in you want them to do their job and you want them to leave

25:34.895 –> 25:35.955
Yeah, absolutely.

25:35.975 –> 25:36.235
All right.

25:36.496 –> 25:38.696
So we definitely talked about that issue enough.

25:39.036 –> 25:51.161
Chip, another victory that I think our incredible industry has had was when New York City decided to change the Airbnb rules and kind of finally put some regulations behind it.

25:51.561 –> 25:54.362
I hear that’s actually bearing some some fruit.

25:55.872 –> 26:00.175
83% reduction in the Airbnb revenue for New York City.

26:01.456 –> 26:01.956
Yeah, 83%.

26:02.516 –> 26:03.117
What does that mean?

26:03.177 –> 26:04.538
Well, that means a lot of things.

26:04.598 –> 26:08.260
It means affordable housing, which is a huge problem across this country.

26:08.280 –> 26:10.922
I mean, you know, I just checked these numbers yesterday.

26:10.942 –> 26:18.627
There’s almost 2 million properties that are actively lit homes that are actively listed right now on these platforms.

26:18.727 –> 26:19.387
And what does that mean?

26:19.407 –> 26:21.369
That means 2 million homes that were built

26:22.315 –> 26:26.858
to be residential for resident that are now commercial operation.

26:27.258 –> 26:30.720
When you take 2 million homes out of the national home stock, what do you think?

26:30.740 –> 26:32.361
I mean, you’ve just reduced supply.

26:32.721 –> 26:38.425
So even if demand stays steady, we know laws of supply and demand that price goes up and now you make it unaffordable.

26:38.685 –> 26:41.207
So in a place like New York City, very difficult for firemen,

26:41.767 –> 26:49.273
for any type of first responder, police and teachers to even live in a reasonable place because you’ve driven the government has driven the prices through the roof.

26:49.673 –> 26:55.077
Or in this case, they’ve allowed someone to come in and take a residential property and shift it over to commercial.

26:55.117 –> 26:56.779
So regulations went in place.

26:56.819 –> 27:05.566
And the reason they’re working in New York where they haven’t worked in other places because New York is going after the platform that has always been the key to this type of enforcement.

27:05.706 –> 27:05.906
Right.

27:06.346 –> 27:15.434
If I what the platforms hide behind is the fact that there’s this thing called CDA 230 and it was put in way back in the day to allow the Internet to grow.

27:15.474 –> 27:23.220
And the basic principle was if I have a platform and someone comes on that platform and you remember today’s guys, it was it was like a chat room, right?

27:23.240 –> 27:23.640
Yeah.

27:23.800 –> 27:29.645
You can’t hold the platform responsible for someone who posts something that is stupid or wrong or illegal.

27:29.845 –> 27:30.026
Right.

27:30.626 –> 27:36.688
But what you should be able to hold the platform accountable for is when they conduct the actual transaction that is illegal.

27:37.048 –> 27:47.732
And so what we’ve seen over the last 10 to 15 years, particularly with Airbnb, is a local community will come in and say, look, you’re not allowed to have these short term rentals in these residential areas.

27:47.752 –> 27:48.752
They weren’t built for that.

27:48.813 –> 27:49.693
They can’t handle that.

27:50.293 –> 27:52.735
And so therefore, this is an illegal short term rental.

27:53.115 –> 27:57.658
The problem was, is that you couldn’t penalize the platform.

27:57.999 –> 27:59.079
You had to go after the owner.

27:59.099 –> 28:01.781
Well, that type of enforcement was almost impossible.

28:01.921 –> 28:02.622
Right.

28:02.662 –> 28:09.347
New York City has done differently to say, no, you, the platform cannot be conducting a transaction that is that we have deemed illegal.

28:09.667 –> 28:16.212
I can’t go online and sell and have a platform that sells illegal narcotics and just hide them.

28:16.812 –> 28:17.032
Right.

28:17.472 –> 28:17.732
Right.

28:17.893 –> 28:20.554
You’re allowed to sell illegal units and just hide behind it.

28:20.574 –> 28:22.455
So New York’s going after the platform.

28:22.795 –> 28:23.515
It’s working.

28:23.795 –> 28:24.996
It’s making a difference.

28:25.276 –> 28:27.097
And I expect we’ll see that in a lot of other cities.

28:27.397 –> 28:32.559
I think that is such a clever solution because it provides it.

28:33.179 –> 28:38.862
It helps you attain the goal without having to worry about what that law is that’s currently in place.

28:39.342 –> 28:40.443
And again, common sense.

28:40.503 –> 28:41.924
You’re going to have that legislation.

28:41.964 –> 28:46.827
You better do it in the right place so you can hold, you know, I want one buck to kick.

28:46.907 –> 28:47.127
Right.

28:47.687 –> 28:48.988
I can’t kick a thousand bucks.

28:49.128 –> 28:50.729
I just my general used to say that to me.

28:51.029 –> 28:52.130
I just want one buck to kick.

28:52.570 –> 28:56.553
And if they’re going after a million people, it’s just it’s it doesn’t it doesn’t make any sense.

28:56.593 –> 28:58.114
So, again, good job.

28:58.234 –> 28:59.555
And, you know, I agree.

29:00.095 –> 29:09.562
I look forward to seeing the revenue and occupancies in New York City grow because we know the expenses are growing everywhere, especially in New York City.

29:09.882 –> 29:19.288
Well, we’ll see what happens in New York City, and we’ll have to have a more detailed conversation on this as well because so much supply has been taken out by those housing the migrants, plus the Airbnb issue.

29:19.328 –> 29:21.970
It’s going to make for an interesting dynamic going forward.

29:22.210 –> 29:23.971
Maybe we can talk to Jan about that tomorrow.

29:25.152 –> 29:27.093
Chip, can you work on congestion pricing, please?

29:27.454 –> 29:27.754
Oh, yeah.

29:28.174 –> 29:29.415
So, Chip, this is interesting.

29:29.615 –> 29:35.640
I know it’s a joke, but producer Dave’s general manager of a hotel in New York City, and he has some employees that drive in.

29:36.000 –> 29:45.867
And this is all of a sudden starting to become a real concern, particularly since overall we’re starting to finally see, as your numbers are saying, slowly improving job market for hotels.

29:45.907 –> 29:48.149
So how do you see New York and then go into the general stuff?

29:49.510 –> 29:50.831
You guys need to elect better people?

29:51.432 –> 29:52.392
That’s all I can say.

29:52.853 –> 29:59.940
Hey, I’m not a New York City resident, so I voted for Michael Bloomberg nicely the first couple times, and then I was out of the city.

30:00.300 –> 30:06.746
But congestion pricing is, again, another crazy idea that is a massive tax problem.

30:07.026 –> 30:33.649
on people who go to work every day you know and when they go to work they’re not working remotely they’re actually going to the physical location and unfortunately those are typically the type of people that can least afford this tax so it’s just a it’s a terrible terrible idea and i hear some of the numbers about what it costs to get into the city now it’s just it’s mind-boggling like most americans are not put up with that right i go into the city for meetings all the time right so um

30:34.562 –> 30:36.543
Last week or a couple weeks ago, I was in the city.

30:36.924 –> 30:37.924
So the tolls are $13.

30:38.825 –> 30:40.806
The gas was probably $8 from my house.

30:41.787 –> 30:43.188
So we’re at $21.

30:43.689 –> 30:45.990
Then parking was $60.

30:47.351 –> 30:48.452
So I’m at $81.

30:49.272 –> 30:51.134
And then congested pricing, we’re at another $20.

30:51.814 –> 30:55.377
So I’m at $100 to go into the city with my car.

30:56.197 –> 30:59.540
Because to go in by train from where I live is two hours.

31:00.160 –> 31:24.981
on a train that’s definitely going to help all the businesses there uh make money right because dollars to drive into new york city dude like i’m telling you i don’t know i don’t want to do live shows from new york city anymore because every time i go in i just feel like i’m going to be getting hit on the head um with that it just doesn’t make any sense but chip outside new york city it’s why it’s why people move to florida they don’t have to put up with this nonsense

31:25.663 –> 31:26.564
Yeah, right.

31:26.804 –> 31:27.304
Yeah.

31:27.344 –> 31:31.706
But everyone should know Dr. Producer Suzanne, who lives in Florida, is laughing behind the stage.

31:31.766 –> 31:39.451
I just hope that they’re putting in really good infrastructure because I can’t imagine with all the people that moved down there that eventually the infrastructure is going to catch up with them.

31:39.491 –> 31:44.633
So listen, I may be there in a couple of years, so make sure it goes all in before I get there.

31:44.694 –> 31:47.235
Yeah, we got to find some new town that’s not up and coming.

31:48.156 –> 31:51.199
Maybe we could create the villages too or something like that.

31:51.659 –> 31:54.022
But overall, how are you seeing labor?

31:54.042 –> 31:58.126
Because a lot of the folks that are coming on this show saying it is easing.

31:58.186 –> 32:02.771
People are coming back to the hotel business, but not at the rate that they’d like to see.

32:03.701 –> 32:04.442
Two things at play.

32:04.842 –> 32:07.284
One, people are coming back, not back to where we were.

32:07.304 –> 32:10.587
We’re still not back to 2019 numbers for total employment.

32:11.227 –> 32:17.773
But as Anthony can tell you, because he’s the type of guy that helps with stuff like this, we’re just better hoteliers.

32:18.013 –> 32:21.156
Because of the pandemic, people know how to do more with less.

32:21.196 –> 32:28.442
I mean, it is those stressful times in life where you find the things that are most important and you make sure you do those well.

32:29.082 –> 32:30.244
And hoteliers have figured that out.

32:30.284 –> 32:36.372
How do we take care of guests realizing we have fewer human resources to do that and relying more on technology?

32:36.392 –> 32:37.413
And it’s working.

32:38.295 –> 32:40.177
I’m working with a company here in New England.

32:40.217 –> 32:44.043
And I can’t tell you, I have never seen a leadership group.

32:44.083 –> 32:45.705
It’s called Hotels Holiday here in New England.

32:46.212 –> 32:53.996
more involved with their employees, more rolling up their sleeves, general managers if they have to cover a shift because somebody needs a day off and needs childhood, whatever.

32:54.457 –> 32:55.297
It is amazing.

32:55.337 –> 33:05.383
I was just talking to a manager that I’m working with, and she just literally told me a story that put tears in my eyes of just how she handled the situation.

33:05.743 –> 33:07.304
with her team today because of the storm.

33:07.344 –> 33:08.504
And she was there.

33:08.924 –> 33:12.486
She said she can’t make beds for her life, but she was there helping them.

33:12.806 –> 33:13.867
She bought everybody lunch.

33:13.887 –> 33:14.587
She was involved.

33:15.207 –> 33:18.249
And if you don’t love, and I always say, you don’t have to like people.

33:18.269 –> 33:19.729
You have to like making people happy.

33:20.149 –> 33:23.331
So if you’re a person that likes to make people happy, whether it be an employee or a guest,

33:24.250 –> 33:31.472
You know, Chip, we’ve had these conversations and we’re working on a program together to get people more interested in this industry.

33:31.512 –> 33:40.815
And not only that it’s a great industry and you can travel anywhere in the world and be in this industry and you don’t have to be in just one job for too long.

33:41.456 –> 33:42.476
Has there ever been a…

33:42.956 –> 33:43.576
Time chip.

33:44.116 –> 33:45.997
And Glenn, you can talk to this too, because you see it.

33:46.337 –> 33:49.878
You know, people that were Bellman that now are CEOs of brands, right?

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25 years.

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You know, I’ve seen people that were Bellman that are general managers in three years now.

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Like, has there ever been a time that’s been better to be in this industry?

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Not for advancement and compensation, that’s for sure.

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I was at a hotel a few months back in Phoenix, and the young man, he was so proud, I was so happy for him, had just been appointed general manager.

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And this is a convention hotel in Phoenix.

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He was still in his 20s.

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He had started the hotel as a 17-year-old parking cars.

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And now he’s at, I think it was like a 300-room hotel in downtown Phoenix, and he’s the GM.

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And that’s a very high-paying job.

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and you just gotta love stories like that and they happen all over the industry because so many people left between 2020 and 2022 there’s just enormous gaps that are still being filled there was a job on linkedin i think it was at one of the five star resorts out in vegas for a butler i swear to god i was so tempted a butler where people think is a butler is like you know butler on batman

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No, that’s not the Butler.

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Butler is you’re dealing with VIPs and you make more money than probably every person in that building.

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Maybe the president of the company makes more than you, but you’re making hundreds and hundreds of thousands of dollars in certain areas of that of the industry.

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So, again, being a banquet captain in New York City.

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You know, I have proof that you make more money than general manager sometimes.

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So you don’t like when people think, you know, I don’t want to work weekends.

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I don’t want to work holidays and I don’t want to make a little bit of money.

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Well, you don’t have to do any of that if you are good at your job and you get yourself into the right position.

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So big advocate.

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This is the only industry I would push everybody into right now.

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If you want freedom, flexibility, you want the gig economy, you can do that here.

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Yeah.

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And make a lot of money.

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And that’s the thing.

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People say there’s no money in the hotel business.

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I go to the convention.

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I go to a party.

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I can’t reach my hand out without hitting a millionaire in the head.

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You’re not going to hit too many people in the head.

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But that’s absolutely true.

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So, you know, there’s a lot of talk about this digital nomad thing, and we’re all looking to hire people.

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What about besides task force?

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What about advertising for hospitality nomads, people that could go out there and work in different cities at different hotels throughout their career?

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Maybe we get the messaging out more on on that.

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I mean, it’s happening organically.

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I mean, that’s one of the reasons why I think people who like to travel are attracted to this industry because they know, to Anthony’s point, good paying job, but the ability to go places they otherwise might not be able to go to.

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And so we see that everywhere.

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And it’s intuitive to people that, hey, I could if I’m serving at a hotel in Paris, I can serve at a hotel in New York City just as easy.

36:51.659 –> 37:20.377
yeah in the brands i have a friend um a friend of our show uh that was a leader of one of their major brands and decided to retire and now she’s basically consulted for this brand and when they need a hotel to open uh or a general manager leaves and she needs to babysit for a couple of months she goes so so far she’s been she just got a new assignment i just saw on linkedin puerto rico yeah and she’s loving life and she’s in life so that’s the gig economy

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absolutely so before we wrap up today um obviously you can’t just draw it in one easy picture because there’s so many different areas of hospitality but what are your expectations for 2024

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I think we’ve hit the top and we’ve plateaued on leisure travel, which is fine, but fine.

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We always wanted to grow, but it’s pretty good right now.

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Small group business is back to where it was.

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It’s been back for quite some time.

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And then the large group business will come back this year to where it was in 2019.

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So I’m thinking that 2024 looks really good.

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If you’re comparing it to 2019, rev par is gonna be up considerably.

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Now, is it above inflation?

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That’s a different story and also depends on where you are because wage inflation has hit different communities in different ways.

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But for hoteliers who say, as they should, how much money am I making on this investment?

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2024 should be a pretty good year.

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Yeah.

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So in that spirit, it looks like that, you know, we’re going to see the Fed knock down those interest rates a number of times throughout the year.

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So that’s going to be a pretty exciting story, I think, to see as it kind of pushes more hotel development that’s out there.

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Well, not only development, transactions.

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I mean, the reality is that you should always remove hurdles from real estate transactions because it only prohibits the improvement of the piece of property, no matter if it’s a piece of vacant land or a hotel.

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And so when you place hurdles in front of that, and Anthony has lived this life, and it makes it more difficult for a new investor to buy that hotel, then the improvements that would go along with that new investment are just not going to happen.

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And so I’ve always been an advocate of,

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for getting rid of hurdles, oftentimes hurdles that don’t make any sense, for reducing real estate transactions.

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We need more real estate transactions, not less.

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I’ve had this argument my entire career with people.

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It’s like, yes, some rich people get some benefits to building hotels or building buildings or building businesses.

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And guess what?

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We get to work in them and we get to feed our family and we get to play.

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So it is the most ridiculous thing, argument I’ve ever heard in my life.

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When we want money to work and when money works for the people that have it, it works for all of us.

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And are there people that take advantage of that?

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Of course.

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Listen, New York City, if you’re working in a hotel, you’re making a nice living.

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If you’re a housekeeper or if you’re working the front desk or you’re working, you’re making a nice living.

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So we need, like you said, we need these impediments to go away so we can get real estate transactions going.

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And the more hurdles, the more people sit on the sidelines and then more people go on social services.

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And the person who’s been on social services when he was growing up, it’s not a fun place to be.

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Yep.

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Chip, any final thoughts?

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I can think of no better place to start my new year.

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And I know today’s the last day of you acknowledging the new year, Glenn.

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I went into July last year.

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It started to get a little weird and awkward for everyone.

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This has been my second podcast of the year, but the first one is not nearly what you guys are.

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I talk about it all the time.

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You used to come from the White House right to our podcast before you went to all the big programs.

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And I must have told that story a hundred times.

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And I can shed a tear over it because that was it helped our platform.

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It helped our reputation.

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But it also helped the industry of that.

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We’re going from Washington right to right to what’s happening now.

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and you get it here first.

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So we will always be thankful for that.

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And I’ll be remiss if I didn’t say you did it again by doubling down and helping me and the industry by funding the production of Hotel All Stars, which is basically ready to be distributed.

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And you’ll be seeing it a lot on social media.

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You’ll be seeing it a lot.

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You’ll have a lot of access to it because you guys funded it.

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When you have a funded show by different industries,

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It has to go to a distribution network like Netflix or Discovery.

41:25.140 –> 41:36.493
Well, we have the opportunity because of you and your decisions to put it on social media that you’ll be seeing a show called Hotel All-Star all over social media platforms very soon.

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So please like it.

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Please watch it.

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And please send it to people because the more people watch it, the more we can have and the more we can show how fun this industry is and how great this industry is.

41:48.182 –> 41:49.803
But again, without you, it doesn’t happen.

41:49.963 –> 41:50.964
Without your team, it doesn’t.

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And by the way, you have the biggest rock star team in the history of rock stars.

41:55.646 –> 41:59.253
I do have a great team and they make me look a lot better than I should.

41:59.854 –> 42:00.916
But speaking of that, I don’t know.

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Is there an award for best reality TV show host?

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Because if there is.

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There should be.

42:08.447 –> 42:09.648
Anthony Melchiorria is the guy.

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Hey, listen, I’ve seen it.

42:11.649 –> 42:14.411
The freaking show looks amazing.

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Well, it is amazing.

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I was up for an Emmy that I didn’t win.

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So there’s a gentleman that won it that deserved it.

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I don’t even think I made it to the final ballot.

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But listen, I’ll give an example.

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I’m going to do that.

42:28.140 –> 42:33.564
The young lady, I didn’t get her name, that was helping before, was in the green room, that was helping before you were on.

42:34.364 –> 42:38.587
All of a sudden, I’m getting ordered around my room to tell me to fix the lighting and to fix my tea.

42:38.827 –> 42:40.729
And I think it’s Suzanne, the producer.

42:40.749 –> 42:48.094
So I’m running around fixing everything, and I sit down, and it’s a young lady I never saw before.

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Yes!

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We’re good.

42:49.935 –> 42:51.296
You have rock stars, my friend.

42:51.597 –> 42:53.318
Yeah, I love that.

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It was good seeing you, too.

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Thanks so much for being here, Chip.

42:56.681 –> 43:01.245
And the good news is we’re talking to their team, trying to get him scheduled on a regular basis for this year.

43:01.305 –> 43:03.547
So that’ll be a whole lot of fun.

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And one thing that would be fun for I know for me and Anthony is you guys would go ahead and download our podcast wherever you get your shows.

43:11.114 –> 43:13.096
And if you’re listening to us right now, why not watch us?

43:13.136 –> 43:14.957
Find us on Facebook, LinkedIn, Twitter.

43:15.678 –> 43:19.641
Instagram, novingatinews.com, and of course on YouTube.

43:19.661 –> 43:21.122
Any final thoughts before we get out here today?

43:22.223 –> 43:26.186
I am making my signs that say Chip Rogers for President of the United States.

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Are you making them too?

43:29.506 –> 43:33.828
I like him too much to see him in that situation.

43:33.928 –> 43:37.609
If he called me and said, hey, I’m thinking about running for president, would you come and help me?

43:37.649 –> 43:41.150
Dude, I’d be on the plane so fast your head would spin.

43:41.670 –> 43:44.591
He’s got it, all the factors you need in order to do that job.

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That’s for sure.

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But I hate to see him get all that vitriol sent his way.

43:50.733 –> 43:51.833
Yes, it’s very difficult.

43:51.853 –> 43:55.414
But Dillian, our industry and the capacity he is, he gets it anyway.

43:55.654 –> 43:56.655
Yeah, totally.

43:56.895 –> 43:57.275
Really good.

43:57.754 –> 44:00.075
And he’s used to it, so it won’t really affect him any.

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All right.

44:01.075 –> 44:07.356
Tomorrow, Jan Freitag of CoStar STR with all the numbers you need to know to be more successful.

44:07.817 –> 44:13.078
And then we got a full boat of shows next week, even though I don’t know where I’m going to be.

44:13.138 –> 44:17.399
I’m going to be in a mystery location next week, which will be revealed at some point.

44:17.918 –> 44:18.138
Yeah.

44:18.158 –> 44:18.959
I don’t know.

44:19.079 –> 44:21.120
I don’t know where I’ll be either, but I’ll be, I’ll be somewhere.

44:21.380 –> 44:21.961
All right, everybody.

44:22.001 –> 44:24.502
Remember, let me remember you got one life.

44:24.522 –> 44:26.824
So blaze on and be kind to yourself.

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Now I click the button and I click the other button tomorrow.